That's part of it although the kaw mech told me if any corrosion DID happen from sitting without coolant, flushing with water will not fix it. You'd need a special compound to clean deposits away. Mainly, I just like to flush with distilled water before adding new coolant because it gets rid of as much of the old stuff as possible. When I flushed with distilled water a couple years back, there were very little solids that came out in the flush water. Just a few dark specs on the bottom of the drain pan.

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"a few dark specks"...well...the water channels do pass through a LOT of gasketed interfaces...maybe just simple 'gasket sealing material'....if it was aluminum pieces...it'd be silver...not black/dark anyway.Corrosion in there would be whitish,silverish colored.Definitely not dark.I would say anyway..if there was serious corrosion going on...you'd have scale chips coming out as well....not so sure something very acidic,even mildly would be at all advisable for an aluminum system.
You don't get that combination right(and who REALLY knows if or WHAT it should be)...you could end up with a seriously vulnerable system surface.I wouldn't want to 'guess' at something like this myself.You add in the motor temperature(possibly as high as 210 degrees)...by riding it with that solution in there...IDK...I wouldn't personally.

* Last updated by: Grn14 on 11/21/2014 @ 9:46 PM *

http://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oemparts/a/kaw/50aa38cef8700226a414675f/water-pipe

Here is the ubeer ripper tear it up dry run. See 49063, the mechanical seal? Run it dry you buy the whole pump. Show me the part number to the blade. No part number to the blade, guess what you buy?

You're going to like this one. Zip-tie the lower hose and fill it up. That way the pump is wet, you run it for 4 seconds or less. It's not the blade, it's the mech-seal that is going to take the friction dry run and you eat the pump.

Signed,

Love my zip tie .> LOL

* Last updated by: Hub on 11/21/2014 @ 9:52 PM *

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Well,yeah..the blade isn't the issue..as you say.It has no friction on it.I'm not sure what you're saying here...when you drain the radiator/engine by removing the feed hose...it will be virtually empty(the pump internals) when you go to start again with new coolant...until the pump starts pulling.So the mechanical seal there is somewhat vulnerable...but it will always be if you drain all fluid and start again.I'm not understanding THIS part of the talk here.What it's relating to....we were talking about flushing out old coolant and doing it with distilled water...or vinegar..then refilling and burping the system.I must be not getting something here...I'd honestly like to know what it is....seriously.I can always learn something I didn't know before....that's what's so good about this forum;)

I mean...whenever I've drained my coolant...there is always some left in the pump housing...sitting along the bottom of it in there.Refilling with the hose connected,the coolant is gonna be entering the vanes(gravity) before it ever turns over...so it's not really like.."dry" when starting the bike.I've always just drained with the hose disconnected...and refilled...started the engine,and watched for the burping effect to happen.If it didn't start burping within several seconds.I shut the engine off...squeezed the hoses a couple of times...then restarted.That would usually get the coolant moving in the radiator(IF IT WASN'T at startup).Once that was happening...then I resqueezed the hoses as it was circulating...and filled again as necessary( I always squeezed the hoses a few times regardless).....Never had any problems with the pump being damaged somehow that I know of?Would it be dripping or something to be able to see if it was damaged?(not from the hose clamps area).

As for the vinegar use...if a guy could determine a 'safe' mixture..that'd be one thing...but not knowing the metallurgy of Kawasaki's aluminum parts in there...it could go very wrong.Having NO coolant...but only water and vinegar..and then running the motor...it's gonna heat up pretty fast and above what it 'should be'...that could be not so good.With that mix in there.Possibly?...maybe?...hell,IDKLOL!!

"Re: cooling system flush with vinegar
I used to do it but found that the mild acid was still too aggressive and led to problems like hoses rotting out from the inside. Now I just flush everything really well with tap water, bring the engine up to full temperature, and repeat as needed. Regular maintenance means never needing the aggressive stuff"

...most said it's fine to use vinegar combined with a bit of baking soda.I guess a vinegar flush is fine....long as you clear the system really well with a final water flush.

* Last updated by: Grn14 on 11/21/2014 @ 10:38 PM *

not so sure something very acidic,even mildly would be at all advisable for an aluminum system.

There are special compounds for certain types of corrosion and certain systems. I was just planning a simple distilled water flush. As you mentioned earlier, that may not even be of any benefit since all the hoses were removed. The only old coolant in there to flush out at this point would probably be a very small amount that is trapped in the water jackets. Who knows if it all drains back to the bottom?

when you drain the radiator/engine by removing the feed hose...it will be virtually empty when you go to start again with new coolant...until the pump starts pulling.

I would imagine the water pump and everything below the radiator gets filled with coolant when you fill the radiator to the top. Also, cranking the engine must turn the water pump. Anything in there will get pumped up into the water jackets as soon as you hit the starter button.

Here is the ubeer ripper tear it up dry run. See 49063, the mechanical seal? Run it dry you buy the whole pump.

The zip tie to the water pump would do it but I'm not going take a chance that that hose gets pumped dry. I'll probably have to crank it over quite a few times before it starts. So I fill it with coolant and don't risk the pump. Grn's right. I don't need to flush anything. There's not enough residual coolant in there to make a difference.

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"Grn's right. I don't need to flush anything"...well...that's a matter of if you WANT to really...my experiences with the cooling system,refilling...checking...having a hot engine and such and trying to remove the cap without that shit bubbling up and out all over the floor and the side of the radiator...it can be a pain. I've tried to just make it as simple as possible.I drain it...I refill it...I start the bike...I watch for coolant movement....once it gets there...I just watch for the drop in volume.....GENTLY massage(tap) the hoses a bit(like the book says)......then fill and recap...and call it good.

"I would imagine the water pump and everything below the radiator gets filled with coolant when you fill the radiator to the top. Also, cranking the engine must turn the water pump. Anything in there will get pumped up into the water jackets as soon as you hit the starter button"...correct..unless the pump is not pulling because of air trapped in there...which is unlikely as you mentioned about the fluid entering the vanes and such...basically 'priming' the pump.That's why you watch that liquid in the top...to make sure it's pulling...it will drop accordingly the more it circulates...which won't take long as you know.If it just sits there at the same full level after starting...something isn't right.(hell...why am I telling YOU this...you know what the F's upLOL!!!!)Sorry.Maybe just cementing this in my own mindLOL!!!I forget shit...sometimes...a lot!

* Last updated by: Grn14 on 11/21/2014 @ 10:58 PM *

Take a mirror, look under the water pump blade housing. There is a drip hole there. The water pump shaft is spun off of the engine. So if say we use the oil pump shaft and it sides out of a seal like a shift shaft, that's the transfer out of the engine. Saw the shaft down the middle so it has a fork kind of end to it. The water pump shaft had 2 flat sides on the end of the shaft. This is keyed or slides into the fork and there is your connection.

So we know the oil seal as the oil side out of the engine. If oil leaks out the weep hole, it's the pump shaft seal. If we have a coolant drip out of the weep hole, it's the mechanical seal that keeps the water in on the water pump side. So your only contact is that porcelain washer that is being pressed on by a spring, loading a hard plastic ring that spins on that porcelain washer. Heat that plastic part against the porcelain when it's dry... The water is the lube in between that porcelain ring and plastic face so the plastic stays cool.

As long as you fill the hose and not the whole radiator just to start the engine... you are making it more complicated than it is. Fire off and kill...

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"As long as you fill the hose and not the whole radiator'just to start the engine'... you are making it more complicated than it is. Fire off and kill..."

(italics mine)'just to start the engine'...

Okay...but when it pulls that hose water on through the pump...now what...with an empty radiator?...I mean..what is this doing?It's emptying the hose...and when killing the motor again...you're right back where you started...having to fill the hose...turn the engine on...and stop when it goes empty again...yes?I don't see the point of this....?????Why not fill the rad...start the bike...and let it run?No refilling(except initially)...no hose removal...system fills...yes?....are you saying that stopping the motor when the hose empties allows the water in the motor to bleed back into the pump?And protect the mechanical seal?I guess I'm just not understanding what's happening in this.I'm trying to....WHERE are you ziptying that hose?At the top of it after you fill it?The lower inlet stays connected to the pump?

* Last updated by: Grn14 on 11/22/2014 @ 1:32 AM *

I'm just saying, yes, you can start it dry.
I'm saying, look at the possible damage you run it for 30 seconds like the fool mentioned is the dry run.
I'm not seeing a major overhaul you need to fire the bike up when you last shut it off. A hose is not part of a major O-Haul.
I'm saying the blade is probably coated with the powder and who knows, only pulling the cover off will tell. But that's years of sitting, not a few months to weeks for the blade to decompose from that.

I'm saying you are upping the odds burning a galled surface if in microscopic > that wasn't there before the analing on the [dry] starting.

1. You know the bike starts and you just have to do what about it? See if bulletproof runs?
2. You add condensation to the cold environment and that attacks the rings and rusts the seat when the valve is open: it happens overnight anyway. Nothing you can do but spray WD and coat things before sending it to bed every time you ride. Are you going to anal about that now?
3. You drain the battery down from a trickle charge that is not the real kind of battery charger like one that peaks at 14 plus then shuts off waiting for the drop to happen and then boosts it again, not hangs at 13v... Don't get me started on chargers.

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"Don't get me started on chargers"...

I figure if the bike ran for 1 second after it fired, it would turn 18.33 revs. I could see cranking it over that many times just to start it. That's 36 revs now with no fluid in the pump.

Heat that plastic part against the porcelain when it's dry... The water is the lube in between that porcelain ring and plastic face so the plastic stays cool.

I suppose. Also, 18 revs running at idle speed will cause more heat than 18 revs cranking on the starter motor. It's not worth the risk of causing even a little galling. I'll just fill with coolant and start it. I can wait until next time I change coolant to flush with water.

...well...that's a matter of if you WANT to really...

That's all it is, "If you want to." At this time of year, in this situation, I'll pass.

(hell...why am I telling YOU this...you know what the F's upLOL!!!!)

I've only done it twice on the 14 and once on the busa, Grn. I'm still learning things about this, myself. Good conversation.

Thanks for info fellas.

* Last updated by: Rook on 11/22/2014 @ 8:39 AM *

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I looked around on some other forums about leaking seals in the Kawasaki Pump.None of em mentioned a 14....so I guess THAT's good;)

SHE LIVES!!!!

Hey, grn, Hub, I charged up the battery and it turned a little slow (small Shorai, cold weather) and started right up on the seventh crank. Briefly saw a little waft of smoke, I think that was a bit of oil burning on the manifold from changing the head cover gasket....or else it was just steam from the radiator filler neck (it's about 40° in the garage). Only other issue was a coolant leak. I found it right away. One of the clamps was barely tightened. I tightened it up about a quarter inch of strap and no more drips. I'll have to go over all of those and make sure they are tight. I was trying to not squeeze to tight on the hoses since the ruber has already been compressed where the clamp wraps around the hoses.

I'm simply elated to hear my baby run again like she should. The night ended with the hoses burped and everything bled out nicely. The motor ran down to normal idle which I set at ~9k rpm. Then it died. No biggy. I think she just ran out of gas. The LOW FUEL indicator was flashing and now I remember I ran that tank down as low as I dare before starting all the work because I knew I would be filling it with fresh treated gas for storage. Never ran the 14 out of gas before. Hope that's all it is. I'm sure it is.

Thanks for all the help. No problems here with a few months sitting dry. Man, I just love this bike and I love working on it!

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I poured a little gas in the tank and she started up. Just ran her out of fuel, that's all.

Now a new problem. Seems like the cooling system must have accumulated some moisture while the system sat dry. I poured in a 50/50 mix of water and coolant and ran that in the bike. It floated 4 balls before i put it in and now it only floats 1. Must have been water in the system. I doubt condensation from running the partially filled system with the radiator cap off could have created that much water. So now I play the guessing/caculating game of adding pure coolant little by little and running it through the system until I get 4 balls to float. Oh well, been there done that. I have all winter.

* Last updated by: Rook on 11/25/2014 @ 9:08 PM *

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