I converted the standard headers from just behind the CO2 sensor and have a 63mm mid pipe all the way to the canister.
Had a dealer(best Kawasaki tuner in RSA) Install a PCV with auto tuner and optimizer for the CO2 sensor. I don't want to flash the ECU yet as its still under the manufacturer warranty.

She runs very smooth but has a splutter around 2500-3500 rpm through all the gears. This is only noticeable in town driving or when slacking down and opening slowly.
She also she seems a bit lazy (compared to my 2009) in first gear but runs like a demon from second onwards.

My 2009 model had 4-1 with 54mm mid pipe and PCV only, she was fast and ran 189 HP.

So i have a few questions.

1. Has anyone had a similar experience with the spluttering at low RPM? how did you rectify it?
2. Is the auto tuner really better than just running a PCV 5 on its own?
3. does the mid pipe diameter make a difference?
4. Lastly on my previous model i blocked the pair valve pipe which removed the rumble and most of the backfire. On Ohlins model there is no difference?? rumbles and back fires

1. Has anyone had spluttering at low RPM? Mapisscrapissing all over that range.
2. Is the auto tuner really better? Yes. Run it.
3. does the mid pipe diameter make a difference? Yes. Even the 'divider' in the header is purpose built for reversion flow. So if that diameter of the OE is not formulated from the tip to the header flange, I'll eat the cat in the header.
4. i blocked the pair valve pipe which removed the backfire. Reinstall the hose and hook up PAIR. Why? The divider is used to cancel a pressure of air back to a cylinder under overlap or when both valves are open at that cylinder. The other cylinder timing is pressuring the open cylinder with the spent it's trying to clean out under that overlap. So the separator plate defuses that bump of air trying to head out any opening. Thus, you see the little crossover tubes at the header that stop that air back in the overlap. Make sense adding more to #3 question?
a. So on overlap, look at the [unspent+hot spent] that sputters with that map now.
b. By reentering that fresh air, I am cleaning up the map with a touch of lean clean air.
c. Why would I mess up the smooth running when fuel is applied with the map [now] as you say.
d. By smooth, I will lose a little via the reinstall of PAIR. I am 'still tuning' or change the map's pissing in way too much fuel.
5. On Ohlins model... rumbles and back fires. Here is the deal with the 02 in the loop. There are two ways to turn it off... flash or disconnect the 02 connector and let the bike default to the backup.
a. You're crying. There is no crying when messing with a computer bike's preset.
b. You are now down on HP but the autotune takes over who cares.
c. If the 02 is in the loop it's fighting that map as if the air cleaner is clogged, no problem.
d. You turned a perfectly running bike with all that formula w/out sputter and now go find the 'sputterfree' like the factory did.
e. Go to the pc software and tell the pc to auto that tune. You have no 02 trying to correct the pc map.

Thanks Hub.
Appreciate your input.

"Install a PCV with auto tuner and optimizer for the CO2 sensor. I don't want to flash the ECU yet as its still under the manufacturer warranty."

Doesn't a PCV void the warranty ?

Welcome. Yeah, foul spark plugs are on you. Other than proving the pc ever damaged the bike... With all those pc's all those years? No worry with warranty.

Listen to what that opti does and what it's not compatible with.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_uISc8l-X4&list=PLVESBT2CE1I3Sq39recNTGpV6ibdJm8Fo&index=1

Thanks Hub.
Carabuser - you are right. The shop that installed my PCV 5 etc is an official Kawasaki dealer. If there is any issue he can remove what needs to be removed and the bike would be for all intent and purpose standard except fo the pipe. It's his advise so I go with that for now.

He also tells me the auto tuner must "learn" some more so now he has adjusted some AF values and I need to spend more time in the lower Rpms and then we re-look at it again.

Listen to what that opti does and what it's not compatible with.

I Get goose bumps. I have always believed doing Manual Edits is Russian Roulette. IF, or " With Out " A simple AFR gauge. How do you, or, anyone know what they have just done to their bike ? Sound ? Nice bike boys, be careful.

Clues if your New. Bike falls forward when lean, Chugs, with Black smoke when Rich

Untamed, Your AFR table in your software is key to fixing that stumble. Most are turning throttle back and forth dumping fuel in the 2% and 5% & 10% rows. Here lies your stumble. Your bike Runs at highway speeds at or under 10% TPS. Keep that # in mind when playing with Auto Tune Up Date(Trims).

The plus and Minus section of the fueling Max and Min are also very important in slamming AFR to Rich, Then too Lean. To big a swing from both sides of the scale makes a mess of your fuel maps. "Stumble Comes to Dance"

Your bike now has the tools to make your AFR line Exactly what "you" want it to be. Learning to use it Takes time.

If you want me to fix your AFR table send your map to me. I, We, will get you sorted. Cheers.

Chris at dynojet says to leave the first 2 rows at zero so the low end [I say] has a cleaner driveability range. That said, there is no racing rpm heading that low thru turns, so no need to tune the columns is the logic.

If you know how to download/upload the pc maps, were is the current map and are the first two columns at the left side showing zero numbers? Zero out those two columns, but first save this map so you can see the numbers that were there and lower them from there> if the zeros upset the tune.

Now...IF they could just create a WiFi connection.Totally remove the having to 'load a map from a computer' deal(having to hook it up and all).THAT would be sweet.Or connecting pigtails to a Computer and such.Don't they KNOW this?LOL!!!Hell...there's remotes for everything out there;)

Hub Thanks for that if makes sense.
Roman I'm away at the moment but will send through my map when I get back next week. Will appreciate you having a look for me.
Cheers

Now...IF they could just create a WiFi connection.Totally remove the having to 'load a map from a computer' deal(having to hook it up and all).THAT would be sweet.Or connecting pigtails to a Computer and such.Don't they KNOW this?LOL!!!Hell...there's remotes for everything out there;)

Look at 1.24 PCV Trims,,,,, Sweet. Not wireless but sounds like this is what you are talking about. Notice in the vid first few seconds the fuel adjust same as there new fuel manager Hub linked above

I will post new pics when the POD 300 gets hooked up

pic shows how we are Data Logging True AFR #'s No guess work. Always Live Stream Shown. No longer have to take anyones word for how "your" bike is truly running.

* Last updated by: Romans on 10/13/2014 @ 7:17 AM *

Getting thereLOL!!!

Getting thereLOL!!!

Lol, yep must be done though. Rolling Dyno For Any Set Up. Without tools shown I would have blown up along time ago. Pushing the limits is engine suicide without the the science in play. I'm going for a bit more power, let you know if she pops.

Got your Map Untamed. Lots wrong but we will get you sorted. Lets start at the beginning.

4. Lastly on my previous model i blocked the pair valve pipe which removed the rumble and most of the backfire. On Ohlins model there is no difference?? rumbles and back fires

Do you do this work yourself ? If so tell me what you did with your hoses from your idle control solenoid. Your PCV #'s indicate your pumping in fresh Air ????

Look at your trims. In all six gears at low RPM, In all six fuel Maps, In all six Fuel AFR tables. Story is here.

2. Is the auto tuner really better than just running a PCV 5 on its own?

Good Question. Auto Tune software is a tool like any other. Use it correctly and yes it's better. It is by no means a set it and for get it tool if you are tuning bottom end. Also very tough if you start off with tuning all six gears with six different fuel maps along with six different AFR tables. That one will hurt the brain. But yes it can be done.

E-Mail Sent.

New Map Built. My fuel tables entered for all six gears. Your AFR table from 3 and 4 copied into all six. Test.

I hope this Helps. Bottom End stutter should be gone.

Cheers

Romans-Thanks for the map. Will load tonight and test.

4. Lastly on my previous model i blocked the pair valve pipe which removed the rumble and most of the backfire. On Ohlins model there is no difference?? rumbles and back fires

Do you do this work yourself ? If so tell me what you did with your hoses from your idle control solenoid. Your PCV #'s indicate your pumping in fresh Air ????

On my LTD version there was one pipe. Removed the whole set up. Blocked the air box hole and bridged the inlets above the motor with a rubber pipe. Result - no more rumble on decel and only a pop at 3500 rpm.

ZZR1400 has two pipes. Right hand side-idle. I left this alone. Left hand side pair I blocked with a marble and cable ties. Result - less rumble, but still noticeable. Less backfire. If I remove it totally like before I get an error code.
I have the std Co2 sensor in with a PC optimiser.

* Last updated by: untamed on 10/29/2014 @ 8:59 AM *

Thanks Romans that map is super cool.

Had a quick ride +\- 100 miles.
- Much smoother through the gears. I took her through all six and up to 280kmh. (Lol , Ran out of road otherwise 300kmh) went through slowly up to just under red line. Coming back I took it quickly as well with no hassle.
- Stutter is 98% gone. At just above 2500 and up to 3000rpm she will stutter only if I roll back on the throttle and on again very slowly or if I keep it at 3000 and ride slowly. This Is really only noticeable in town driving.
- Rumble on deceleration is just about gone
- idle could be smoother. It's not rough per say it's more of a dip and increase every few seconds.
Even the sound is different, seems to be a deeper growl but that could be my imagination.

Romans - I have done 600 kms since loading the map you gave me. Before I accept trims on the auto tune is there anything I need to look out for or adjust?
I still have the splutter, but like I said its limited to +\- 3000 rpm, and mainly when I decel and then slowly accelerate again.

Thanks again for the help

Before I accept trims on the auto tune is there anything I need to look out for or adjust?

Yes, send it to me. I can look at it as soon as it arrives. This will tell all.

Map sent.

Map sent

Got it.

Ok, I'm at a bit of a loss to understand how your bike is pulling up to 10% fuel in gears 1 2 3 in the exact area that you describe having the stutter. Gears 4 5 6 are recommending Zero Fuel Trims so there ok. I just went over your AFR tables again and what is happening here is impossible as I know it. Do you know what I'm saying ? Your bike is tuning a area in the AFR table that I have turned off. So how did this happen ?

My guess is when you cleared all trims before the ride, trims were only cleared on your screen. This is confusing to most so don't be alarmed. When you select clear all trims and the screen clears "It Means Nothing" You must go to step two and Send that cleared map into the Power Commander other wise the cleared screen is only for only your viewing pleasure. If I'm correct it means you are running my maps with your old trims.

1. Clear your current Fuel Trims.

2. Send Map into power Commander.

3. Get Map From power Commander

4. Check Trims, They must all be zero's or you did nothing.

5. Ride Bike.

In most cases guys will cycle throttle back and forth causing un burnt fuel to be dumped in a area of the low end Vacuum side of the map(usually). This causes auto tune see a rich AFR and pulls fuel. this creates a Lean condition.

Power Commander/Auto Tune Is doing it's job. We must Always remember Auto Tune is only a tool, we the user must learn to use it properly and make it do what we want. Too Many have given up blaming the tool.

There are two more things I need you to do after we First verify the maps. Sorry you must repeat the test as the data that was gathered is corrupt.

If you have the patients to work through this the results will be a tune made on your bike, your fuel at your elevation. Nothing could be better.

I hope this helps Cheers.

Untamed I was just thinking I should advise you that you are starting off at a "Extremely High Skill Level".

Building Six different fuel maps for six different gears at all RPM levels requires a very high skill set. Going to Hurt The Head before it's over. Frustration may get the best of you. It's Not Easy to do what you are trying do. Thinking there is only Two ways this could end up. One, Grand Master of the tune. Two Rubber Room. Just wanted to make sure you knew this ??? I should have told you this before.

Untamed I was just thinking I should advise you that you are starting off at a "Extremely High Skill Level".
Building Six different fuel maps for six different gears at all RPM levels requires a very high skill set. Going to Hurt The Head before it's over. Frustration may get the best of you. It's Not Easy to do what you are trying do. Thinking there is only Two ways this could end up. One, Grand Master of the tune. Two Rubber Room. Just wanted to make sure you knew this ??? I should have told you this before.

Appreciate the comments. I have a fairly decent technical ability, however I need to start somewhere with the PCV. I understand the mapping and concept of the auto tune. "With a little help from my friends" (you+the forum) and perseverance I'm hoping to at least solve my initial problem and at the same time learn how to get a tune that works for me/my bike.

will re-load the map, check that trims are cleared properly this time and then test again. will feed back in a few kms.

I need to start somewhere with the PCV.

Yes Agree but why make it so hard on yourself ? Let me explain

As you can see In each PCV map there is Ten throttle position rows. Forty Five RPM Rows that concern us. That makes 450 fuels to look at or adjust. This can prove hard enough if you're just starting out.

Now With your current 6 gear set up, You Now have six Times Four Hundred Fifty Fuels cells to look at. That combined with the Exact same fuel cells in your trim windows equals 5400 possible windows.

One fueling map for all Gears is the way Kawi does it inside the ECU. That being said, it might prove much easier for you to learn how to master the Auto Tuning software one PCV Fuel Map at a time. Afterwards go to the 6 gear fuel tune.

Please don't think I'm pushing you in this direction just need to make sure you know. I will guide you through it either way.

Send map when your ready.

cheers.

I hear you. I'm all ears walk me through it. Where would you suggest I start.
cheers

* Last updated by: untamed on 11/13/2014 @ 6:51 AM *