The new BMW S1000RR could be a game changer if the rumoured 185 to 190 rear wheel HP is true and if the dynamic traction control, ABS brakes and quick shifting options are as good as the hype would indicate. I do know this, Dan Kyle at Dan Kyle Racing tested a bone stock brand new unit and it spun the dyno to 186 HP, that's no bull and some serious ponies. He thinks when loosened up a bit it could break 190 rear wheel. Other rumours are saying the pre-release machines were ringers and that BMW has had to down tune them to keep the lower ends intact. We shall see when they get a literbike shootout going over here.

The next question is will the Big Four feel compelled to respond and if so how? There are rumours that this class may go away completely in the future due to poor sales or at least, development will slow dramatically now that 20 somethings are finding it much more difficult to get financing these days.

That’s one hell of a bike I won't even go near one because if I sit on one its over I'll think about the thing 24/7 until I have one. BMW has done what no one else has been able to on its first try beat the big four at there own game. I can't wait the see what Japan is going to bring to the table. If they only match the BMW in terms of performance numbers they will still fall short. The BMW consist of much better components than any Jap bikes and the retail prices are close. The way I see it Japans only option is to make bikes that will have every option the top of the line BMW offers but hold the same retail prices of the current models. I wonder how long Kaw will hold onto the zx14 they have been at war with the Busa for a long time and actually made a two bikes that were better IMOP the zx12 and the zx14 however year after year they lose in terms of sales. There is a reason Honda did away with the Blackbird I'm sure. Its been a two man race for a long time with no real development especially on the part of the Busa. If I had to guess I would bet the zx14 is going to go bye bye if not in 2011 than for sure in 2012. The Busa still has a strong following so I can't see that going any place. Honda makes more bikes than anyone in the world by a long shoot. I don't think they are going to turn a big part of that market share over to BMW because they created one good bike

* Last updated by: willidx4 on 3/10/2010 @ 2:11 PM *

BMW needs to win at the track and on the sales floor before the big 4 get concerned. MSRP may be close but actual sales price isnt and either is volume.

Once upon a time the best cameras in the world were made in Germany,same applied to stereo,the Japanese beat them.I have a lot of respect for german engineering,BMW,Porsche,but I cant see Japan taking a back seat to Germany in the motorcycle industry

You have the psychological brand aspect with the nose in the air I ride a Beemer. You have a plethora of codes that may triple the 14's as to what I saw telemetry wise. I know at least 2 of the Big4 can have any part of that bike to you in a 2-day order, you about to miss a track-day or race-day waiting any longer. Then again, I do not own a Duc/KTM/BMW kind of low production small cottage industry are those brands. They are not making ships/corp jets/heavy industry kind of companies building a car or two.

I talked to one BMW dealer and they could not get a corporate answer as to where the bikes are being made today? So, we looked at the OEM parts bags to see place of origin? It sure was knot zMade in Germ many is not too many bikes being built in da fart tear land either.

WATT can go wrong with the bike when a MBz service manager I met saidiss; we are both [strangers] on bikes somewhere and struck up conversation. He is telling me how cheap the MBz are made with the computer crap going belly up, are most of his gripes about the brand he has to hear in his ear are the upitty owners... OK, some of them.

You've already heard about the 1000's recall with the minor computer [rpm break-in] glitch. You gonna believe them like a pee-us gas pedal is the problem is more the computer glitching some fly bye wire goes the rev lock. I rather go over the back because ZI locked the bike's throttle bell crank, not some fly by wire Yamaha that might send me flying I need to practice kill switching???

You want to mess with Honda? Honda has the fastest top speed in a closed course. Beat the Duc's speed. Kawi has the fastest production bike. Has Kawi beat Honda/Duc closed course? Cottage bikes beat Honda say they are sleeping at the wheel and will dust come back and take it back no sweat. They are THE bike to beat. Honda just rolled back the throttle is all. Duc has been winning for years. I'm just saying Honda has been in the 4-stroke game longer and with more money and R&D to keep it up front.

This new contender, it is not that bike, nor Ruben. The bike is/was the fastest last year as this year. That would be my bike of choice is the one with the most promise. Next year is a new speed. But if we are talking today, and last year with the Bummer, it's that management group behind Xaus that is holding up my rider. I'd sand bag and look over to the right [inside joke] is just enough over the line they don't knowatthend game is! Dumb germ mans wit dare mess ear schmits is shit inn mit in their ears get a clue!

Lets get some real racing going already!

* Last updated by: Hub on 3/11/2010 @ 8:24 AM *

So much hype on this bike, never seen anything like it and that's sayin somethin cause the bike rags over-hype EVERYTHING! Day sell a bunch of magazines dat way. Ok, literbike shootouts will start rolling in by May or June and we'll see how the challenger does. If it can win the hearts and minds of the testers, it might just have a fighting chance in the showrooms. On the other hand, that $16,000+ OTD price tag puts it out of reach for many. It may turn out like the $70,000 V-4 Ducati Desmocedicci, too expensive to own except by the privileged few and then the technology surpassed in a few years by an $11,000 Japanese bike.

* Last updated by: Kruz on 3/11/2010 @ 8:35 AM *

Someone said the $10K bike days were numbered. That was last year's Daytona interview by a magazine tech editor of the old Cycle mag days. Sure enough, Suz is sitting on piles of 1000cc bikes from last year. They will not import any 10 or maybe 11's until that inventory depletes or they will be sitting on another few years of leftovers.

They ramp the price of the german junk and once you leave the lot.... What a drop in the price you turn around and sell it thinking it is that marque of a name it would hold it's value. But the public knows better. Not after my 2 BMW's. I've learned my lesson. I saw that 1000 still sitting on the dealer floor when I took a walk around of it.

There is no way that bike would act as powerful as the 14. 113lbs vs. 83 pounds of wee near shitsell is buy another 14 I am so spoiled with this torque baby.

I heard the rumour about Suzuki's leftovers the other day. Where were these bikes when I was shopping? I bought two new liters in '09 but no Suzi. Suzi didn't lower the prices like everyone else and just sat on their stockpile so they still have a ton left over and they're still not discounting. That's good for Suzuki owners cause it keeps the resale value higher kinda like a Hardly. Let's face it, everyone got caught with their pants down in '08 and to some extent '09 with big time over supply. Motorcycles will be in shorter supply in the next few years as they adjust inventories, don't know where retail prices are headed, just glad I'm stocked up right now. Next couple of years will be interesting for everyone in this industry, quick, cheap loans for 20 year olds have all but dried up and that was a big market share for liters. How many 50 somethings ride crotch rockets? Most are on a Hardly or getting ready to retire. Market for a $16,0000 BMW remains to be seen. I don't see them taking major share away form the Japs with this bike, I don't care how good it is. Same with the Aprilia RSV4, I've seen maybe two Aprilias in my entire life and they got no dealer network. Ever priced spare parts for a BMW automobile? And what about all the electronics? German electronics are a far sight better than either Italian or British but still below Jap reliability. OK, I'm through rambling now!

Hub from what I could gather from your post you are trying to make connection between factory backed race bikes and production bikes and I'm not sure why. The fact that you may or may not have to wait on a part for a BMW means nothing to normal consumers like me and 99% of the people who might buy the bike. look lets stop trying to find fault with the BMW I am sure its not perfect and yes it is expensive at least for my taste. The bottomline is its overall performance is better than anything else in its class and thats what matters in that line of bikes.

stop it you guys want one just like I do

squidly on his BMW

williD, If you read my post, I find fault with the BMW, but I am still a, 'phantom buyer' where I would swap out bikes during my racing career just to stay competitive in said class. Since H-D was more the bike to beat running BOTT, it was a BMW or a H-D. At the time, H-D was paying $500 to win. I came in second. I had the bike to win since I was leading. It was me who backed off knowing this was my last race. That was then.

This is now my only entertainment is to pick riders in the beginning of the season and see how well my guy/gal finished out? I've had Rossi since 1999. Last year I picked RG for drag racing and he won. He is my guy for Dracing. Rossi keeps winning GP. So, this continues as if I am on the bike of choice and it so happens I've been watching X-factor for awhile. Since he is on a combination I would choose is that it just so happens my rider is on the RR.

If you caught practice, Ruben came in #1 in that practice round earlier in the year not his co-rider. But yes, his team mate came in 7th in a race. So goes the nail biting. Has Duc been beating butt? Yes. I'm all for a new brand to come along and do damage, don't get me wrong if it's Ruben X on the RR so be it. I just want to win, phantom style.

Like I said, the rider side of the RR is one way of looking at it like you said, williD. I look at the bike as a race bike being as close to buying a factory ride kind of mentality as you can get. No bike is coming with presets for race mode more than say this bike with ABS, slick mode and all that anti wheel spin selection is your ball selection.

The bottomline is its overall performance is better than anything else in its class and thats what matters in that line of bikes.

Yup, I have to agree. I want one...........maybe next year.

The japs have more to worry about at the bottom of the scale than at the top, lots of new bike makers eroding the bottom of there base markets, is more of a problem than the elite at the top. 16k for the BMW is basically being given away, to get it out in the market, sold here for 22k or more. once the silly season of the world economy levels out and price is part of a growth business plan and not a survival one ,They will all go up, there will be more of a gap from the japs to the Europeans than just a price rise, the japs will still make the best product and look more affordable but will be dearer to buy. The Germans can't give them away at those prices forever.

* Last updated by: ethin14 on 3/11/2010 @ 6:00 PM *

The first from our German friends the one that started it all.?????

* Last updated by: ethin14 on 3/12/2010 @ 3:58 AM *

willidx4 wrote :

The bottomline is its overall performance is better than anything else in its class and thats what matters in that line of bikes.

I love BMWs, 2 and 4 wheel versions both.

But what you say, we don't know for a fact. There is no definitive performance tests, and no racing results, to bear out what you are asserting. So as of now, it is merely conjecture.

But what you say, we don't know for a fact. There is no definitive performance tests, and no racing results, to bear out what you are asserting. So as of now, it is merely conjecture.

Agreed, it is purely speculation at this point. Like I said I can't wait to see the liter shootouts start hitting the newstands at the end of May. Only by getting the new Beemer and Aprilia out on the racetrack and probably more importantly, the streets with it's Japanese competitiors, will we see if all the hype is warranted.

love BMWs, 2 and 4 wheel versions both.

But what you say, we don't know for a fact. There is no definitive performance tests, and no racing results, to bear out what you are asserting. So as of now, it is merely conjecture.

I guess it depends on what you will accept as proof.Racing results mean nothing when we are talking about production bikes. If we relied on racing results to tell us how good a production bike is or will be the zx10 would be junk bike but we know that’s not the case. If you are willing to accept magazine reviews as definitive proof then I think the question as been answered here at least Master Bike. There are a few others also which have placed the BMW ahead of the CBR and we all know how much the print media loves the CBR.The difference in performance between any of the 1000s pretty much means nothing to me and 99% of the rest of the world. But when it’s time to pull out the ruler and start measuring dicks as thats what bike mags do in these reviews. Once again I think the Japanese will come out on the short end.

* Last updated by: willidx4 on 3/12/2010 @ 9:29 AM *

the streets with it's Japanese competitiors, will we see if all the hype is warranted.

The BMW will great on the street well at least when compared to a R6

To me, there is a huge distinction between discussions with bikes' performance on the GP circuit and the bikes made available for the open public. The GP bikes are setup so differently than their stock counterparts, it's not even funny. It's like willidx4 said, if you base your decision on the outcome of GP races for your next bike, you've no real foundation to base that decision for what's available on the showroom floor since the stuff's so cutting edge.

Conjecture - I agree. Only when the rubber meets the road will we see whether the Bimmer is a real phenom or not. So far, I like what I see and I think they'll do well, provided they put fast riders in the saddle, obviously.

But I'd like to talk about sales between the new German sportbike versus the tried and true Japanese bikes. Price plays a major role in the decisions of the open public and, from where I'm sitting, especially with the economy the way it is, I don't see these new 1000RR's rolling off the shelves at anywhere near the pace of the Jap 4 any time soon. I feel like I have twice the bike for half the cost when I look at BMW's newest liter AND their previous offerings. I don't see a Kawi any less reliable than the BMW's if they're well taken care of. Even after making all the modifications that come with a typical BMW bike for my 14, I'm still way out on top monetarily-speaking.

That said, I think the new literbike from BMW is a good-looking bike and I applaud BMW for their foray into such a competitive market. I hope they do well. Honestly, I love most all motorized two-wheel vehicles and am excited any time something new comes out because of my passion with motorcycling so...really no ill refute with any one vendor. Hell, if I had the money, I'd literally have a warehouse full of just about every model of every bike made, truth be told.

$16,000? they can't even give these away at less than half that price!

http://dallas.craigslist.org/ftw/mcy/1637597382.html

I think the base price of the BMW is 13800 but yes that zx10 is still almost half the price and 99% of the BMWs total performance. Hell I would buy that and a CBR before I would get a full loaded BMW or even tha base model for that matter. Has anyone seen a comparo of the base model vs the Jap bikes?? I bet the lap times will be a bit slower without all the aids of the top model

* Last updated by: willidx4 on 3/12/2010 @ 2:20 PM *

No official shootouts yet Willi but one magazine editor ran one back to back with a modded '09 GSXR 1000 and said performance was "comparable" by seat of the pants analysis. The Gixxer was dynoed at mid 170s rear wheel so that gives you some idea of the performance...but then again seat of the pants can be misleading. I can't wait to see hard data on 1/4 quarter mile times, 0-60, 60-80 top gear rollons, weights and of course the big HP and torque numbers. The Aprilia RSV4 got the same kind of press treatment with big HP numbers being touted early on before the bottom ends started letting go. Two were put on a dyno by Cycle World and as I remember neither broke 150 rear wheel HP, I think it was 146, R1 territory...hmmmmmmmmmm.....

Hell I would buy that and a CBR before I would get a full loaded BMW or even tha base model for that matter.

There ya go, at $7499, I'm tempted to go pick up another one in green...somebody stop me ....pleeeeeeze!

* Last updated by: Kruz on 3/12/2010 @ 2:38 PM *

Talk about Market BMW knows a thing or two about the subject. They might not sell as many bikes as Honda but they have them beat by a mile when it comes to marketing that’s for damn sure. Gerry Refferty German bike who would of “thunk it”

BMW on ice

That was quite nuts. When I was in Anchorage, I saw a couple of bikes with spikes on the bottom, but they definitely didn't look like those.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOl1Mwvdp9w&NR=1 <<< 7 Second Pull.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lc8K9BZdmu4&feature=related <<< Average 10 seconds @ 79 pounds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTq5li3p2oQ&feature=related <<< 7 Seconds and you know there is at least 103 pounds shaving off some ICE SO WOT!

I'm going to roll up a 10 penny nail and nail that little shitoepiece between my toe jam see if that stink can keep up 3 seconds down.