Hey guys,
I have a 2016 ZX14r and a 2001 zx12r. I have had the 12 for 14 yrs and the 14 for 1.5 yrs. I am not feeling the 14. The 12 feels like an extension when I ride it. It might take a little more effort but I am comfortable on it. The 14 is smooth but I feel disconnected. The 14 has chicken strips, the 12 does not. The 12 wheelies all the time, the 14 does not. I am 6'3' but the 14 feels big while the 12 is just right. When I got the 14 I figured I would get used to it but it is not happening. I like riding it but I don't feel one with it. I am thinking it is just the tires. The factory Bridgestones have slipped since day one. I have been using Michelin PP2ct on the 12 for years. I will try them on the 14 and see if life changes. I have been riding for over 30 years and the 14 is my first new bike. I hope things change with new tires. I have read all the stories about how the 14 is so superior to the 12, but I am not feeling it.

* Last updated by: z1rtctim on 8/5/2019 @ 10:11 PM *

I went from a 92 ZX11 to my 06 14 and was very happy with everything that was just a lot better. Yes the bike does feel bigger. But it is very capable. I always ran the PP2ct's on my 11 and used them on my 14. When I started doing trackdays I switched to the Dunlop Q3s which gave me even more confidence. Now that I am riding a ZX10 on the track I switched to Pirelli supercorsas. A little more expensive but you can get the rear in a 200/55 which raises the back of the bike slightly changing the steering geometry. Bike reacts a lot quicker to steer inputs.

Welcome to the forum.
Dave

You like what you like and you have a right to feel that way...its your money ! Personally I never could get with the 12R program but that's just me. I really liked my ZX11's and the 14 just feels like a much improved version of them.

well,if you're not feelin it,then you don't like it.It's okay to say that!LOL.Best I think then to get somethin else ya DO like.Like an H2 lol.How about that new Beemer 1000.Honestly,I could never keep a bike I didn't connect with.That's what riding's all about for me.I had an 04 zx12 also.Fricken sweet machine.Traded up for the 07 14.It was okay.i didn't regret it.14 aint for everyone.I barely ride mine since I got my 2015 h2 in 2015.Pretty different and exxciting.Always feel good riding it.

* Last updated by: Grn14 on 8/6/2019 @ 5:59 PM *

Always takes me at least a year to get completely comfortable on a new (to me) bike. Also takes about that long to make all the small changes that bring about that comfort.

The Blue Whale would loft the front wheel just by winding it out in the first three gears, I can't imagine a 14R that has it's front tire stuck to the ground under power, esp. at higher rpm.

Get your ECU reflashed. Kawasaki retarded the timing in 1-4 gears until 4000rpm. Unleash all those ponies and wheelies! Your OEM exhaust weighs about 50lb. Get a Titanium system. Your Bike will weigh about the same as your zx12.
Use this website to compare seating positions.
http://cycle-ergo.com/

Danno, the 14 doesn't have any problems doing wheelies, I just don't feel as comfortable doing them as I do on the 12.I like everything about the the bike it is just taking longer than I thought it would to become comfortable on it. Like a new baseball glove doesn't feel as good as your old one. I am sure a set of Pilot Powers are going to do it for me.

Whatever tire you put on, make it a 190/55. The bike will turn in a lot quicker. Go to a 200/55 if that will fit your swingarm. A 200/55 works on my Gen1 with a 45T sprocket and one extra chain link over stock. That's about as large in diameter as will fit my bike.

Yes, comfort doing wheelies...the busa doesn't feel any better than the 14 so that's not the answer for you. You're probably better not doing long wheelies on a 14 anyway. The Gen1 was said to experience oil starvation from high long wheelies. IDK how the Gen2 is about this.

Rook, keep in mind that increasing the diameter of the rear tire also raises the seat height. For some (many?) ZX-14R riders, this is undesirable as the very wide seat makes even the stock height feel unusually high, and makes it hard for a rider with a 29 or 30 inch inseam to plant his/her feet on the pavement securely, especially when there is debris or gravel or rain on the ground.

It also makes the tire heavier, and that has a notable adverse effect on its moment of inertia, and thus both handling and acceleration.

Jim G

* Last updated by: JimGnitecki on 8/12/2019 @ 11:33 AM *

"Always takes me at least a year to get completely comfortable on a new (to me) bike."...lol.You're supposed to ride it at least a couple of times after ya get it....jus sayin...LOL.;)

It also makes the tire heavier, and that has a notable adverse effect on its moment of inertia, and thus both handling and acceleration.

The few 200/55 slicks I weighed were about a pound heavier than the 190/55 I weighed. IDK if they put more rubber on a slick or if that had more to do with the increased tread radius. I would imagine a 180/55 would be much lighter.

Yes Rook, I would go narrower than OEM if I was reasonably sure that the narrower width would not cause any issues. I value nimbleness.

Jim G

I remember the 12 came with a 200 stock and everyone was recommending going to 180 for cornering. Is the 14 not the same?

Yeah a smaller tire is a "nimble" concept but the current modern street best tires like the super corsa have material tire compounds I like to take advantage of. Im running the supre corsa in a 200 and I take advantage of the larger contact patch to corner a bit faster than I believe I would on the stock size. On the 580 lb whale I dont recommend a smaller "nimble" tire

CrudeRudy: YOUR ZX may be 580 lb. MINE is 561 lb with fuel now, and 523.8 lb before fuel. :)

Jim G

* Last updated by: JimGnitecki on 8/14/2019 @ 6:34 PM *

The MotoGP bikes run a 200 and don't seem to have a problem with being "nimble". I think less weight has a lot to do with being nimble. I never had a problem cornering the 12R. The 14R has a different design concept to enhance 1/4 mile/sport touring performance, not track performance.

Z1rtctim, maybe a H2 or 10R may be what you seek...

ahhlou: The 200 series tire used in Moto bear little to no resemblance to street 200 size tires, so are not a valid comparison for us street riders!

And yes,light weight is precisely the point in creating "nimble". A 180 tire is going to be lighter than an otherwise identical 200 series tire.

Jim G

The taller 200 takes away swing arm angle and decreases trail. This creates better/quicker turn in on corner entry.

The 200 has a larger contact patch, but does not increase grip. Larger contact patch does not
add additional grip, but it will give you a little more rubber on the sides of the tire for greater lean angles.

Also the larger contact patch can extended tire life.

* Last updated by: piken on 8/15/2019 @ 1:02 PM *

<<keep in mind that increasing the diameter of the rear tire also raises the seat height. For some (many?) ZX-14R riders, this is undesirable as the very wide seat makes even the stock height feel unusually high, and makes it hard for a rider with a 29 or 30 inch inseam to plant his/her feet on the pavement securely, especially when there is debris or gravel or rain on the ground.>>

I've always had this problem, being 5'3". On my 14R, I lowered the back about 1 1/2 inches with a link and dropped the front end about 1 inch. I also had the OEM seat redone to take almost an inch out of it. The result was dramatic. I can actually plant my feet on the ground. As far as handling, after backing off on front preload to compensate for the lesser drop than the back, the bike handles better than before. Because I am a lightweight, there is no issue with peg clearance.
Hopefully, someone will benefit from my experience.

The points in the following Motorcycle Garage episode seem to contradict some points made here on tire width and grip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hPTiYh4fic

What I have come to realize is that this is a very complex subject with non-consensus views even from "experts".

* Last updated by: ahhlou on 8/16/2019 @ 10:07 AM *

Just as long as you're not calling "Motorcycle Garage" the experts?

It's all about the maths.

Here's something that can put a spin a contact patch and grip.

This is a big gambling sport in Japan.

*** Race Video ***

Race Video

* Last updated by: piken on 8/16/2019 @ 3:39 PM *

Excellent video piken. Thanks. On the turns the lightest bike (5) is the clear winner. On the straight it was the two super bikes with the upper hand. Confusing subject, many variables.

All this to say the 200 felt at home on the 12r. On the 14r the 190 feels fine but I am sure a 180 would work as well...

I was also not 'feeling' my 14...

Until,

1. -1 Front Sprocket

2. Guhl Flash

Woke it up! It's a big bike. Didn't seem to have the 'snap' I was used to on my old Gixxer...

Another suggestion:

Try the H2 SX SE.

Same power, smaller, lighter bike. Kinda like a V-8 vs a Turbo V-6.

Compared all the liter bikes I’ve had, the 14R has the same or more snap. I think it’s perception. The 14R is geared way taller than than the light liter bikes. 6th gear on my S1000RR was like 4th gear on the 14R.

The H2 SX seems to be a great bike. But it’s only 20 lbs. lighter than the 14R. A friend has one and had it tuned. He got 230 on the dyno. I compared his dyno chart to my bike ( which has a full exhaust and a flash), and the 14R made significantly more power and torque all the way to 10K rpm, where the H2 SX then surpassed it past 11K. I kept my gearing stock but I can’t imagine the difference going -1 in front.

I am 6'3", liter bikes are not an option. I got the ZX12 because it was a big bike. The 14 was just a natural progression. I am comparing its flip ability with the 12, which I rode for 13 yrs. I am sure it is just a matter of getting used to it and a set of tires. The stock Bridgestones have a round section while the Pilot Powers have a "V" section. The 12 would dive into turns while the 14 seems to lumber into them. I can't throw away good tires so a tire change will have to wait till next summer.

* Last updated by: z1rtctim on 8/26/2019 @ 8:28 PM *