....I take cash, check or paypal. Thanks!

Kruz

I'm curious-aside from oil starvation,what type of fuel mixtures could cause an engine like ours to blow?How could I tell if my engine was headed for the boneyard-or could I?

Too lean. Rich is always safer.

* Last updated by: heathun on 9/25/2009 @ 10:42 AM *

I'm curious-aside from oil starvation,what type of fuel mixtures could cause an engine like ours to blow?How could I tell if my engine was headed for the boneyard-or could I?

Continuous, high power, high speed running with a very lean mixture could get you a hole in a piston. I wouldn't worry though Blue, you'd have symptoms of high coolant temp and some big ol flat spots in your powerband if she were really that lean. If the ZX-14 map is working as good as you guys say it is then the mixture is probably fine. You can't go too rich, at about 8 to 1 AFR the flame just peters out and the engine quits running. You'll foul a plug before you get that rich, $60 on Iridium, cough, cough, just ask Monster.

Kruz

* Last updated by: Kruz on 9/25/2009 @ 10:51 AM *

I went ahead and ordered a map from Jeff. I'll put it in and see what she does, if it needs tweaking I'll call him and get ger straight. It's no different than taking it to local tuner and sticking her on the dyno. One run won't produce good results, it usually takes many runs and tweaking. After talikng with him at length I'm confident he'll have me in the ballpark if not spot on and I'm certain it'll be better than the DJ map I'm running now.

Kruz said;

Blue, all the tuners I've known learned to tune by tuning if that makes any sense.

I was unhappy with my ZX14 when I thought it wasn't running perfectly...and then I saw a guy on a Honda 125.

I was unhappy with my ZX14 when I thought it wasn't running perfectly...and then I saw a guy on a Honda 125.

Talk about perspective. Thats funny right there.

Folks, for those who don't know what we are talking about here is a map table. This one is from the M125-006 map for CBR 1000RR with Yoshimura full system and was mapped by targeting a specific AFR at each cell (RPM and Throttle Position) while on a brake dyno under load. The theory is the AFR remains constant at about12.8 to 13.2 but not the % fuel as airflow (volumetric efficiency)changes. Notice 0% throttle is the vertical column on the far left. All zeros means they're running the same injector duty cycle as the stock ECM in this column i.e. baseline settings. The rest of the numbers that are different from zero in all the other cells is + or - fuel in % of duty cycle relative to the baseline zero map i.e. stock ECU setting. You can see they have changed a lot from the stock ECU settings everywhere except the 0% throttle column. The zeros at the very top of the chart are not important becasue you can't run in those areas i.e rpm below idle of 1250 rpm is not attainable or 100% throttle at idle, you just can't get there so they don't mess with it. You could stick +5000 in those cells and the engine wouldn't know the difference.

This next screen shot is in Map Compare Mode and here compares the M125-006 to M125-000 Zero map (stock ECU settings). Notice the M125-006 curve in blue is way different from stock zero map (straight line at zero). Where the graph is above the zero line it's + fuel, below the zero line is - fuel and at the zero line is same as stock ECU settings. This graph is at 100% throttle, column on far left is 100% high lighted in blue to show the active throttle position.

Kruz

* Last updated by: Kruz on 9/25/2009 @ 1:10 PM *

I am guessing the AssMapee Room would be near the castle, somewhere between the fire breathing dragon and the fire shitting Monster bike.

LOL, Hub U a bad man

* Last updated by: Romans on 9/25/2009 @ 5:58 PM *

The bike was running BEAUTIFULLY before I installed the new map. It's running EVEN BETTER now... -bg

nope .. something can't run beautiful and then run better .. it either runs great or it just running ..

AND HUB I STAND CORRECTED ..I FORGOT ABOUT THAT SENSOR under my butt sniffing the pressure ..

bad ur maps would prob benefit us if we lived our lives like you ..a 1/4mi at a time but im sure the rest of us dont just use the 100% throttle setting alone, so how do your maps work for the real world of just putting round town or taking a nice cruise through the hills just curious

PERFECT .I'VE been on several 1000 plus mile rides in a day ..

my bike is a street bike with 41k miles .i get around 150 miles per tank riding on highway with out being on high boost ..

the track is the testing grounds to perfect my bike for the street when i roll-on from 70mph or were ever i hit it..

but i do have 450 1/4 mile passes on my turbo bike motor ... i like to see just some of these know it all map guru's do that with the same motor ..

Rotties hot button is big dyno numbers and he doesn't care about throttle response. I'd be miserable on his ride. Are you getting my point here?

i don't know where you come up with this stuff. but i'd bet you my throttle respones is better than your stocker .. but if we gonna bet its gonna be worth my while .. or you can ride your azz down here..

i only dyno my bike to get a base line map ..then i tune it with a DATALOGGER and an A/F METER or 02 SENSOR in real world riding ..

now you telling me your generic map can compare to that ..

i also have a multi-hub with 2 maps loaded at a flip of a switch . .. azzkicker and death is what i call those 2 .. but i also have a collection of other maps i made that i download to my bike when needed..

oh and kruz the last time my bike was dyno was to verify that my a/f equipment was working correctly ..and the dyno guy lost me 10hp and made my bike sick .. but i corrected his screw-up

* Last updated by: Badzx14r on 9/25/2009 @ 7:31 PM *

hub thats a bad azz self tuning model .. i got 2 get me 1 .

Hub, you light up my life!!! A good way to start a day with a nice chuckle. You go boy!

Used Ivans TRE $40
Used Muzzy Advancer $60
New Scorpian slip ons $400 (only used right side)
Catless factory came extra with the bike $0

Ride home from dealer -- looks good but what a pc a no low end crap is this
After above mods -- Whaoh horsey Whoah

Somethin worked - musta been the TRE (for Hubster) :)

Eight pages now, much nay-saying, lets all dog Jeffo and FAICS, lots of bad vibes...Very nice. Makes me want to abandon this forum. Jeez.
Heres the straight up on Jeffo and FAICS first hand. Now I've been doing the high performance thing for over 30 years, made my living as a profesional M/C mechanic, ran three Kawie service departments, one H.D service department and even had my own shop. Spent way too much time on performance bikes, spent way too much time road racing and drag racing. Pretty much made the whole thing a lifestyle. I'm damn good at jetting carbs and tuning bikes in general. I can smell a poser about a mile away.
The fuel injection thing, pretty damn neat, but also new to me. "Hmm" I think, wish I could meet someone whos knows something about it and has some real-world hands on experience. I stumble across the FAICS thread.
I email Jeffo on my way out the door, dinner with Mom. About an hour later my cell is buzzing at me, so I excuse myself, step outside and return the call. Its Jeffo. "Hey, what are you doing right now?" he asks, full of enthusiasm.
After a short chat, turns out hes right up the road from me. We set up to tune my bike on saturday over at his garage.
I call him saturday morning, he apologizes that hes on the phone with another customer, can he call me back? I totaly respect this, "No problem Jeff, you take your time". The man is taking care of buisness...I am impressed, old buisness first.
He calls back shortly, I take a drive to his place. I decide to shut the hell up and let this guy ramble so I can get a feel for him, when I arrive he's chatting with another customer, doing an impressive job of walking him thru some map mods, seems there is a flat spot down low that he's chasing. I notice the huge collection of maps on his computer, this isnt his first rodeo, thats a fact. I see he has owns an Aprilia. Wow, look at the exaust pipe color I think, its freakin perfect even by my fussy standards. Hmmm.
Jeff hangs up after instructing the customer to call back after his test ride so they can discuss the results. He looks me in the eye, shakes my hand firmly and we get to work. He tells me the mods he just made on the phone could benefit me, we'll see when he calls back.
Jeffo is showing me all kinds of stuff regarding map modifications and how the software works. After 10 minutes of schooling, I am ready to give him his money. In goes my new map. The bike immediately starts to idle better. I'm shown how to set the throttle position correctly, we discuss the accel pump feature, and how it effects the mapping. "Nice" I think, "He realizes it affects the mapping..."
The phone rings, its the customer Jeff was talking with earlier. Problem is solved, customer is pleased. Jeffo verifys hes happy before hanging up. "Keep in touch" Jeffo tells the man, "Anything at all."
I'm off for a test ride. Jeff doesnt want his money until I am happy. The bike is happy, it runs smooth, pulls great, top end is there, and the exaust popping on decell is way improved. All the things that had been bugging me about the "jetting" as I comute to work every day, resolved. Crisp, gentlemen, Crisp. I return and cant get the money out of my wallet fast enough. If there had been an extra 20 in there, I probably would have handed that over too.
We start talking, conversation heads over to his Aprilia. He shows me some spark plugs that are unreal, they are PERFECT. I realize that he knows how to read a spark plug correctly as he tells me to look at the inner porcelian. "See the combustion ring?" he asks. Hmmm, I thought I was the only one left in the world who knew anything about the lost art of reading a plug.
He insists I take the Aprilia for a ride, claiming the bike is mapped dead-nuts perfect. Bike looks like fun, and thats a damned bold claim....perfect huh? Off I go for another ride. Its a bit too loud for my taste, but the mapping is indeed, dead nuts on. I try to find fault with it, no such luck. Man could I get tickets on this bike. Its a fast,light, agile twin that handles like a dream, and if only I had had this bike back when I was racing.
Returning to Jeffo's place, we start to chat over a very impressive brew-ski. I like this guy. Hes old-school like I am, and has a very methodical way of approaching mapping that makes total sense. HE makes total sense, something I dont see enough of nowadays. I am impressed with his over the phone skills. Its obvious he wants his customers to be happy, as evident by the two to three call he takes while I am there. The folks he's dealing with hang up happy.
So the bottom line: Those dogging Jeffo and his service need to get the hell off his back. 99% of the things I've read about the guy are positive, then we have the whiney vocal few....
Heres a thought. If you have a problem, CALL THE MAN BACK and let him make things good instead of running your mouth and creating ill-will here in forum land. Grow up for gods sake. Hes a good man, has a good service, and wants his customers to be satisfied. Are you perhaps unwilling to give him the opportunity to make good? I know, why should he be given anoter shot at it when it wasnt right the first time? Well, tell me honestly that you have never tried something and have it not work out initally? And gee, any chance there was a pre-existing issue with your bike BEFORE you tried his map out?
Dont know I'll be bothering with this forum much in the future, I was looking for some good conversation and maybe a little info here and there. Guess its not meant to be. And oh yeah, he doesnt thik much of the TRE,so there.
Lighten up, gentlemaen.

* Last updated by: AzZX14 on 9/27/2009 @ 12:52 PM *

Well said

I rode 440 miles yesterday without one issue the bike runs flawless popping and backfiring is gone. If I was Jeffo I wouldn't call any of you guys back I would refund your money and tell you to pound salt not the type of people I would want as my customers. It's really a shame because people can learn a lot from this forum but now I see it is full of a bunch of whiney little bitches. If you go and buy say a tv and it has problems do you go online and whine? I doubt it normal people would return to where they bought it and get the problem resolved. The issues people have had with their maps are no different call the man and he will fix it. He told everyone that from the start. Grow the fuck up

if you can't tune your own bike ..i really don't think any of you have any GOOD INFO to share .. or a voice to stand -on or a pot to piss in ..
Just my thinking ..

but by all means tell us how great of a map you installed thats CUSTOM to your bike .. AND HOW GREATLY IMPROVED IT IS ..

Another voice heard from.
Gee, I AM capable of tuning my own bike, but recognize the fact that there may be others out there who can show me a trick or two.
So I guess Bad zx14r has never met someone whos better than himself at doing something?
Clint Eastwood said it best..."A man needs to know his limitations."

* Last updated by: AzZX14 on 9/27/2009 @ 5:10 PM *

And there it is.
Good job laying it out Blue07.

hey Azzx14, that was me with Jeff on the phone. So you went ahead and did it huh. it looks like we also have the same SE in common

Kewlness. I laughed like hell when you told me "Dont do it".
So let me guess, your bike runs happy too?
Uh huh, yeah, Jeffo sucks.
NOT!!!!

So I guess Bad zx14r has never met someone whos better than himself at doing something?

SURE I HAVE .. but not at tuning my bike .. and especially over the phone ..

you guys must also be big into phone sex instead of the real thang

* Last updated by: Badzx14r on 9/27/2009 @ 8:10 PM *

Just proving that I can copy and paste ..............

I have a Brock's map for my SMEG that Brock spent many hours devloping and it's DEAD ON!
I don't have a dyno or a datalogger to be able to tune.
What I do have is the ability to copy and paste and make Brock's map my own, sorta.
I could then sell my "custom map" 'cause I'm a "tuning genius" for a bargain price, 'cause guess how much I have invested.
Not that Jeffo would do that ......

Regardless, it's a shame that someone didn't quote his tirade, and now he deleted it.
I don't care who he is or what his skilz - I don't do business with his kind.