So, I learned to "1 finger" the brake during dirt cycle training, and I still do this while riding this super sport on the street.

I've read how it's effective on the track too, for those moments when light pressure is needed on the front brake.

My problem is, when faced with an immediate need for emergency brake, I'm still just using one finger on the front.

That is, I initiate the emergency brake with the finger that's there, on the handle, and I can not seem to get my other fingers to cooperate in releasing the "death grip" on the throttle, and getting them on the brake lever.

Anyone else in this boat with me?

Anyone have a training method to solve it?

Practice.That's all it is...muscle memory.

Lots of pinkie braking for a long time here. Lots of practice of locking the front brake to the point of skidding, then release the brake lever to overcome the panic stop of skidding. So you release and reapply the brakes just as quick. Since you conditioned yourself to release the brake under the skidding effect, you are aware of the situation thru said practice routines.

Traffic wise I have all 4 fingers on the clutch and brake levers. If I have to hammer the brake; I want full grip.
When traffic is light or getting off an exit, the pinkie kicks back in. You'll have to run the fingers in panic mode and break that habit of one finger.

Run all 4 fingers over the lever and keep them there during the ride. Do all your braking with fingers not a single digit. The index or pinkie finger will return to the lever, but you'll be more conditioned to grab with more digits under a panic situation. That's pretty much my routine.

I run the Pazzo shorty levers which essentially limit me to 2 finger. Allows me to keep a firm grip on the bars and have controlled braking. I have done some practice braking and even with just the 2 fingers in a panic like situation I can get the big girls ass light enough to make the rear brake useless.
Dave

typically use two fingers on street and track.

Middle finger only always (no pun). More than enough force for hard braking.

Agreed. Practice. Most of us here grew up being taught a bunch of ridiculous shit. I was always suspicious of it. We were taught our tongues had different areas of taste (sweet up front so we could lick things..ugh). We were taught that some of us could roll or twist our tongues and if you could or couldn't it was all genetic. I don't know what sort of 4 elements "science" this was based on but ffs it was stupid.

I could twist my tongue (over) counterclockwise but not clockwise. Hey i guess I have counter clockwise genes! A few years ago I taught my tongue to twist clockwise too. It started with using my fingers to twist my tongue that way. It wasnt very long from then, I could just command my tongue to twist either way. I guess I'm a genetic engineer now...changed my genes in a couple days!

So anyway, my point is even if you have to start with the most basic tasks in what you want to do, it might literally involve using your one hand to move fingres of your other hand. Can you do the Vulcan sign? Can you do Vulcan sign jumping jacks? If you can't now, I guarantee you start from the basics and just move your fingers with the other hand in about an hour you'll be channeling Spock!

I've had a similar struggle with two finger clutching and keeping the other two fingers wrapped around the grip. I can do it now really trouble free, but once in a while first starting out on a ride it's a "stretch", not just natural.

I find it uncomfortable to leave two fingers on the brake lever all the time. I only do it when I am anticipating the possible need to brake ASAP. Seems to work fine. No problems releasing the throtttle. I did have one situation last summer where I was headed into a very technical low speed corner as fast as I dare take it. I found myself on the brake, throttle and slipping the clutch all at the same time. I hope that was instinct and not panic! It sure felt cool and as near as I can remember, everything seemed to make sense.

* Last updated by: Rook on 12/20/2016 @ 6:43 PM *

I can see there's a bunch of different ideas here.

I sense the common theme: Practice. Yup, I got that. Check!

I have the most problem when I consider Hub's advice of using "all fingers, all the time". I *think* read to do that during practice mode, but I also read in there he does that full time in "traffic mode". It's a good, sound idea at the core. He strives to get all the fingers involved in lever control, but I see he's still switching off between full and single digit control, depending on intended circumstances. To me, where that falls apart is, when the circumstances are un-intended, un-foreseen, there's still a transition period needed from many-to-one, or one-to-many. Also, How does one hang on to the grip, if all of the fingers are on the lever? I've tried this, it's pretty tough to get fine motor control over the throttle when theres no full grip on that control.

Part of whats driving me to re-train here is, I'm anticipating a weaker hand as I age. That one finger that I've used to get full effect while front braking? Well, that finger / hand muscle aint as strong as it u-ster were.

That, and muscle control will take longer. I want to develop the muscle memory while I've still got half a brain.

I did say "death grip" on the throttle, above. I can't really go that far, I want to believe I do have enough personal, physical control to remain calm and relaxed during emergency manouvers. I don't think I'm BS-ing myself too much with that statement. I do practice this stuff, and so far (knock wood, eh?) I have not found the need to use it much. I hear a horn at me maybe once a year, maybe twice. Not more than that.

I'll need some time to consider all the *very helpful* ideas here. Really, there's something valuable here from everyone. Thanks!

* Last updated by: mebgardner on 12/21/2016 @ 6:40 PM *

How does one hang on to the grip, if all of the fingers are on the lever? I've tried this, it's pretty tough to get fine motor control over the throttle when theres no full grip on that control.

Here's how i think of it: you're holding the throttle against the spring tension of that actuator on the T-bobies/ Doesn't matter if you're holding the throttle with one finger or two -----you're always holding it with your thumb around the back side of the grip. Tilt your wrist forward while gripping with the thumb and whatever fingers are on the throttle...feel the brake lever with the fingers on the brake lever. It doesn't even matter if you have all fingers on the brake lever. You still have that thumb and palm of your hand on the throttle grip.

What is so GREAT about the 14's brake is that you just touch it and you feel the power right away. you don't need to search for the right point, it's right there under your finger(s).

So practice. I need practice too. Man. you can brake so deep into those corners....LOL you don't need to on the street but you can so why not do it? Scare the crap out of the people waiting at the stoplight.

Yeah! They scare the crap out of me often enough!

Yeah!!

Get a hand squeeze thingy;)I got into a 'habit' of using my index finger and the one in the middle.I also have a throttle lock on both my bikes.That works well to allow me to rest my fingers on the lever and not have to manipulate the throttle.Whatever works for ya.My right hand has been broken(knuckles).With gloves on,it can be a shade time consuming to move my fingers from around the grip to the lever.They don't move like they used to...but it's okay.I practice moving them during my rides.

I'm moving to the idea of using two fingers, instead of just one (I use index only right now).

Rook is right, the OEM brakes on the front are great!

So, I'm thinking that two fingers is likely to take me through my elder years, strength wise.

As an aside, I adopted one finger during dirt cycle practice because of my unnerving ability to attempt to throw myself off the back of the cycle due to "whiskey throttle".

I did that a few times, and decided I liked having a full grip on the handles! Saved my ass from going off the back a few times...

These days, I don't do that so much :)

Where in the wrist to lever to fingers [being] straight out are those positions? In other words, you more roll the fingers out naturally if the wrist is in its comfortable position, the fingers aiming straight out from there is where the lever should be resting is under those fingers.

Too high a lever your hands reach up and the wrist moves.
Too low a pitch your wrist moves again.

This may or may not help the weak at said appendage.

Yeah, you can adjust the height of the lever by loosening up the master cylinder clamp bolts. I believe there is a small stamp on the bar that lines up with the seam in the clamp if you ever want to go back to OEM position. ...or just make a mark with a sharp punch set or a spot of paint.

You'll have to run the fingers in panic mode and break that habit of one finger.

Run all 4 fingers over the lever and keep them there during the ride. Do all your braking with fingers not a single digit. The index or pinkie finger will return to the lever, but you'll be more conditioned to grab with more digits under a panic situation. That's pretty much my routine.

I've decided to go with this, for now, for (re)training.

It was a toss-up for me, between this, and running two fingers full time, instead of one. I may run two fingers in the future, after I get the "furl / unfurl" under better control.

*That's* where I really need the help, is getting more fingers on the levers, during emergency situations (as in, "bolt from the blue" situations).

Part of what helped me decide was Rook's explanation of the palm heel and thumb holding the throttle. That is of course what occurs, but I had to read it to realize it. That action makes the 4-fingers furl / unfurl, possible for a time.

I think this advice will help. Thanks Rook, Hub!

* Last updated by: mebgardner on 12/23/2016 @ 8:29 AM *

With my first bike and this bike i generally used 2 finger braking and 3 finger clutching. As I've got into more sport riding oriented 3 finger clutching really showed it's weakness, particularly during hard acceleration. Fortunately both bikes I've owned have had I guess better than average OE brakes.

i use 2 fingers on both sides, with shorty levers. I like this because it also allows me to keep 2 fingers wrapped on the grips at all times. And 2 fingers are always strong enough to activate the brakes (or clutch) full tilt as needed, yet also optimal just for dragging the brakes. So the nice thing about this method is, there's no need for transitions...ever. In a panic situation, the 1/2 second it takes to get those fingers on the brake lever and pull it could mean wrecking, and even life and death.

about the only thing I wish I had was a spacer between the grip stop of about 1/2", since my hands aren't big enough put put my palms up to the stop and line up only 2 fingers on the levers... or if my levers were about 1/2" shorter yet.

Merry Christmas to my friends here at 14R Forums!

Hi Vic (and, Merry Christmas!):

For a new rider of anything, 3 finger grip on an accelerating cycle is a recipe for disaster. For stopping, maybe not so much. I'm not implying you're a beginner, I'm confirming the point you made about 3 finger grip. This is a good reason for new riders to start on a "small-ish" cycle. It keeps them seated during, ummm, "those" moments.

You make another good point or two: Good brakes matter, and a skilled rider can adjust their method to "fit" the brakes. Got excellent brakes? Consider moving to a 1 finger "at the ready". Not so good brakes? Maybe 2 then.

I'm still practicing the transition method Hub described above. I have two training goals: To improve my emergency braking technique with an eye towards "getting her stopped quick from a unforeseen emergency", and to improve my brake strength in my fingers-to-hands muscles / tendons with an eye towards my aging muscles and coordination.

I think Hub has offered me a good recipe for training for both.

I get your point about the transition time. Using more time to make the stop is bad, less time is better. Transition time from few-to-many fingers eats into that "$1 worth of braking time to spend". Your point about using 2 fingers to alleviate the need for a transition is good, and its' why we use 1 or 2 "at the ready". But, it does not help me with my goal #2. I own and ride cycles where 2 fingers will be a minimum for me to ride them safely, in conditions I want to ride them (off road). Their brakes are the "not so good" variety, and I'm usually bouncing around when I need them most.

So, the training is being adopted, to fill a long term goal *and* to fill a hole in my current technique.

I tried this yesterday. I can tell you it feels "unnatural", and hurts. The area between middle finger and third has to stretch more to fulfill my request for a 2 finger grip. Also, keeping and changing a throttle position with just thumb and heel also hurts (the heel becomes sore), and I lose a large amount of fine pitch control on the throttle. ie: I'm not "smooth". I have to consciously think about what I'm doing, for now.

But, it does work. I find I make many transitions between 2 finger and more, when I'm using the method Hub described. I can already see that eventually, this 2 finger "at the ready" will feel natural, and I'll seamlessly transition to more if I have time, and use whats there with more power, if I do not. Movements will become unconscious, as good training always does.

It has been my pleasure to converse with you guys this year.

Thank you all, for the leg up!

* Last updated by: mebgardner on 12/24/2016 @ 9:24 AM *