I have a stock '09 14 and have been planning on getting the TiWinder (2006-2009) ZX-14 Full Titanium Sidewinder Exhaust System- Blue Anode Oxidation Finish and I was wondering if I need or should get anything else like a ZX-14 2009 Dynojet Power Commander PCV or a ZX-14 2008-2009 Dynojet Power Commander III-USB any suggestions or help is greatly appreciated. thanks.

18mm O2 bungs are pre-installed PCv has the 02 but for a single 02 plug in? Brock uses dual 02's and might not have a 3rd for a single sniff off of the 4 pipes. You would need a bung at the collector where all 4 pipes feed into 1, so the one sensor reads all 4 cylinders.

From Brocks: "Dual O2 bosses allow independent Air/Fuel measurements in headpipes 1&2 and/or 3&4 for more precise cylinder ‘trim’ measurements." I would assume you have the 18mm plugs installed when you receive the exhaust system. Then, you can step down to the PC-3 without any 02's being used. Better make sure the PCv has access for dual 02's or it's a waste of a bung location, unless you run two Pee See about that wire job. Besides, I've not read up on the latest FI aftermarket products to know if you can run dual 02's. Call Brock on that.

YOu did not say if you are using this for race or street. You made no mention of flies in or out of the throttle bodies. Here is where you can get away without using a piggy; if the subs are in play. Technically, you can run without damage to the bike being the fuel trim is preset, the 14 does not rely on the 02 to calc a fuel load.

The approach to the tune is; where are you going with this? Ask yourself, how much tune do you want to throw at it? I would ask myself these few questions and answer with:

1. Am I ever going to race in a closed course, be it straight line or curves? We do not have optimum ground clearance with this style pipe. What am repeating is more the generic go pick a pipe and here is the problem juggling if I need said fuel cutters? Yes, I want the PiG for max performance, I'm taking it to the edge is have it there when I get dare.

2. Will I bust balls on the roads, never pay for 1/4 mile times or trackday is do it on the street is play there? Well, yes again. If I have that type spirit to come up against some fun is happen chance? I want to be ready is what have they got is match dare ass is, next...

3... Say instead, I'm the kind of guy that needs a good sound, I'm sick of stock or like slips is better looking for me. I'm thinking, there are guy/gals reading this, would rather pass on all that tech stuff, would rather ride with my one big mod. Kind of change things around, I can get away with just a pipe and haul on the street, the bike... The bike is fast enough, I'll never use that much power is just taste some of it. Then, no, I do not need a piggy. I understand the concept, that if I WOT the throttle as fast as I can with the bike in neutral, that tells me the electrics fed that fuel all the way up the rpm range to the limiter no matter how fast I can snap the throttle, the air speed followed. Show me a lean condition.

Slow me a lean condition I'm not beating that bike every time out is wind it up a lot. No piggy, no subs, a gutted pipe makes it 4-in-1 is the faster flow is one side with the one door open more. No engine damage is hear the sound of that note. Know you're facts from fallacy, you need to tune the bike to the moon.

"Chug-Chug, Cough-Cough UP a map someone... Mine smells BaDanShit." Say nut inn 2 know won.

Ah, the "I have a stock 14" is to assume you have them in. I can say I ride a stock 14 too... Cough-Couch.

Yea it is stock, flies in. It is my Daily Rider and I want it to have the capability to kick some ass if needed, but if I get a chance to go to the track to either drag or race I will definatly go.....thanks for the info i am kinda new to this bike performance stuff.

That's a great pipe, Dr. You'll cut a ton of weight and be spitting out all kinds of power but I wouldn't think about track racing unless you have a track with all left hand turns. Drag racing and LSR, you'll be set.

I do not know where the o2 bung(s) are located on a Brock's pipe but it seems logical that one of them should be located in a place after the 4 headpipes so that you could sample from all 4 cylinders. My o2 bung is positioned right where the the system reduces to 2 pipes. I was concerned because the bung is placed on one side and seems not in the path of exhaust from both banks. I was told that the sensor would not be any more effective if placed in a perfectly central location. All of the cylinders should have the same o2 emission (and if they do not, reading all of them will not solve that problem). If you're not going to bother with an Autotune module, the o2 bungs will be irrelevant. Brock is known for a very good selection of maps and I doubt if Autotune would make much improvement you will be able to feel. If you do want Autotune and you don't like the position of the bung, you can always have a new one welded in.

You will need a PC before running any full system because, as Hub mentioned, you will have increased flow a great deal. You will need a PC map (provided by Brock) to match the fuel to the increased intake/exhaust. Either the PCIII or the PCV will be fine. I always recommend the PCV because it uses a separate tune for each gear and it is more detailed in other regards. It will work with Autotune but they do not currently have an LCD that will work with the PCV.

rook do you know if they r coming out with an LCD for the PCV? Also from what the site is saying right handed turns are great due to clearance......??? i keep hearing that i wont be able to do tight rt turns but that contradicts what the site says im confused....

* Last updated by: DrHardin on 2/6/2010 @ 8:46 AM *

dr listen to these brocks duals and youl still be able to do the twisties

http://www.brockracing.com/Exhaust_Videos/CT_Series/Dual_and_Single.htm

but i think i am in love with the megaphone style am i the only one here i dunno i just love the looks of it simple and wow

* Last updated by: DrHardin on 2/6/2010 @ 9:22 AM *

Ricky made his fastest runs with the Side Winder and it is a cool looking pipe but if you ever want to corner, you will be scraping that $1500 of pipe. In fact, I believe it will down right tip you over if you ever need to really lean hard.

but i think i am in love with the megaphone style am i the only one here i dunno

You can go with a megaphone that is high exit like what i have, or a Brock's streetmeg or shortmeg. They don't show all the pipe which is probably what you like in a sidewinder. If you go with a sidewinder, you may want to try to find a used one to see how it works for you. I would imagine that will be a hard pipe to sell because as you can see, not many people want to deal with the clearance risks.

NO NO NO Brock told me No as everyone else did. He said that if I want to hit the twisties and do some Draggin don't get that pipe but look at this one CT MEGAPHONE FULL EXHAUST ZX-14 (06-09) This one He said they are working on the blue anode finish and I don't know does anyone on here run this system? Do you like it?

^^I was going to tell you the same thing but you seem stuck on a sidewinder. If I were going to switch pipes, the CT single would be it. Extremely light weight, best hp of all of brock's pipes and pretty good looking. Not terribly loud if you don't go for super loud drag pipes. You get Brock's mapping too. You would have no problem selling that on or off the bike.

I don't think that CT is going to be beat by any other pipe for some time. If it were me, I'd go with a CT system. If you're stuck on the look of a sidewinder, get yourself a used one someday.

Sorry, no personal experience with the CT. You ask at bikeland where there is a strong contingent of racing members and I'm sure you will get a very positive recommendation.

Yea it is stock, flies in... kick some ass if needed... thanks for the info i am kinda new to this bike performance stuff.

Well, if you were a low rider that needed to save the car's body from shaving away the metal, you can run the pipe that way to get that look you want. If your 'need for speed' is to haul around a turn, better buy two style pipes. Brock can't tuck that pipe [you like] any tighter or lose the round of the pipe curves. Slowing down a straight pipe(pun there somewhere) is a no-no.

That is why there are so many styles of pipes for specific applications. In other words, doc, you are stuck in a hard place you don't snap out of it.

The left photo has an idea of clearance; if you placed a piece of cardboard butted up against the tires, raise the cardboard till the pipe or foot peg hits first. Then you know who is going to grind on the ground and send the back wheel up in the air. Try to imagine that with the other pipe sticking out waaaaaaaay tooooo far. Ain'tathe pits!

Doc wrote:

rook do you know if they r coming out with an LCD for the PCV? Also from what the site is saying right handed turns are great due to clearance......??? i keep hearing that i wont be able to do tight rt turns but that contradicts what the site says im confused....

I was told last summer that they "should " be coming out with an LCD for the PCV "soon." I enquired last month and was told the same thing - "soon."

I have the LCD and I was able to load some other firmware into it over the internet through an interactive session with a DJ tech. My LCD can now read the fuel trims from my Autotune but it can not accept them or do anything else that requires communication between the LCD and the PC. That will only be possible when they update the PCV firmware and I'm sure that will be the same time they start selling the LCD for the PCV. It will be identical except the firmware.

If you want PCV/LCD/Autotune right now, I believe there is a way to do it. You just get the Wideband 2 Commander instead of the Autotune. I can't comment on it because I don't have that setup but I believe the DJ tech I talked to suggested something like that or else just wait until the PCV firmware is updated.

* Last updated by: Rook on 2/7/2010 @ 2:36 PM *

HUB, ROOK thanks for all the help you guys sure know you sh*t. It will be a few more months before I get an exhaust system, But I merely want to be ready for it by buying the recommended stuff prior to the exhuast. what stuff would I need?

^^The PC. I'm a believer in that for a full system. I've never tried running my 4-2-1 without a PC but I've always heard it could lead to big trouble without the PC and you won't get the best performance from your pipe. The PC is easy to install except for the main wiring harness is very tight. You might want to look at this thread for some tips even if you do not go with the under seat installation. The connection procedure is the same regardless of the positioning of the module.

http://www.zx14ninjaforums.com/messages.cfm?threadid=CB3D3987-1372-66AE-3BE3B16BC01CC701

You might want to reuse the stock header gaskets since you have so few miles. They are the little brassy looking rings that surround each exhaust outlet on the motor. If you change them they are available from a dealer or Schnitz racing for about $16. I changed my header gaskets to ensure a good seal. If you need to pry on the gaskets to get them out, be very careful to not score the machined surface that they set against. It would be best to pry against the tongue that sticks up in the exhaust outlet. You'll see that when you get the stock header off.

I used a spray on high temp copper sealant on the new gaskets.

Some people suggest locktight for the header nuts. I'm afraid to use red locktight because that might make it hard to get them off again or it might make tightening difficult, should that be necessary. I used a high temp anti locking agent on the header studs.

Other than the ordinary tools, I think that's about it.

* Last updated by: Rook on 2/8/2010 @ 9:35 AM *