Got a call from the shop that has had my bike all winter - in storage.

I dropped it off for some bodywork replacement stemming from an unauthorized trip in the back of a pickup. They let me leave it there while the parts were ordered and winter prevented me from bringing it home.

After installing Brocks CT Duals, Ecu flash, PcV, and Bmc air filter it made 206 hp and 121 tq.

No graph yet, I will post that after I pick it up next Monday, weather permitting. Im not tickled to death, but I'm not disappointed either. Either one of those will come after the first ride.... :) .

Wait... you're not thrilled with those #s?

Excuse my ignorance but doesn't a flash negate the need for a PC ?

Good numbers !

206 seems good to me

Excuse my ignorance but doesn't a flash negate the need for a PC ?

MAN64, say you couldn't flash the ECU but it's at these numbers. Wouldn't a pig find more: like they do when a pc is used on most ECU's? I think Cblast's torque is 119tq @ 212hp? I'd have to look at the graft change between both bikes.

To me, the reflash is akin to putting in different cams and adding the PC is like slotting the sprockets so you can tweak the timing. You can do one or the other, but both together would yield max effect.

* Last updated by: Danno on 3/26/2014 @ 5:41 PM *

I really hope you guys don't ever run across a stingy dyno. Most guys are seeing low 190s with a full system. I think some of our members would commit suicide if they saw anything less than 200. I let my timeslips do the horsepower measuring.

Here is a post from the world famous Brock concerning using the PC and the ECU reflashing together. The man knows his stuff.

Brock,

With all the testing and tuning that you have done to develop your maps and now the ability to flash almost all aspects of the ECU, have you started looking into added this element to your flash so that we no longer need to use the P/C?

No. ECU tuning has been available for the Busa's for years and we don't tune THE FUEL MAP with the ECU of them either. It's far too coarse- I can tune a Power Commander in 250 RPM increments and genuinely OUT ACCELERATE an ECU Fuel Map tune (in the real world/any day of the week) in real world testing (+ ride smoother and get better fuel mileage in the process). I use a special program from Dynojet to develop our maps, which allows us to ramp a pre-programmed load at specific throttle positions. This 'controlled load/acceleration rate' helps keep engine heat/ coolant temp etc. more consistent than any type of cell by cell tuning and makes for a much better starting point for track (lambda sensor) tuning. I can also produce these maps and e-mail them to my customers anywhere in the world (no shipping/hassle required), and outrun their 'fresh dyno tune' on a stock engine using our parts 9 times out of 10, if they follow the instructions in our private owners group. See this FAQ for more info: http://www.brocksperformance.com/absolutefm/?f=234

We will crack the ECU to increase peak RPM (a little) - very few bikes need much, if any more than 400-500 RPM. We will remove speed limiters and VERY RARELY adjust ignition timing (only on a couple of Kaws, it's a 100% waste of time on Suzuki's). Anyone who thinks ignition timing adjustments need to be made on most modern sportbikes are either A: sorely misled B: Using the wrong fuel for their application C: using Nitrous Oxide and need to RETARD their timing.

We leave ECU tuning to the 'at home tuners and pro's' because the chances of them doing more harm than good is SO GREAT (detonation, pre-ignition, blown head gaskets, dropped valves, broken valve springs, damaged ring lands, scuffed pistons, scuffed bearings, broken rods, bearing failure -- LOTS of BEARING FAILURE >see: timing adjustments leading to excessive cylinder pressure<... the list goes on and on. Oh yea, your bike slows down one day and the power never returns... it's ok, it's just A LITTLE hurt, nothing replacing a slightly damaged ring land wont cure.)

We don't have enough phone lines or people to keep up with the problems - especially when the 'advantages' aren't worth perusing compared to our 'Brock set-up" using our products and knowledge which are designed to last as long as your OEM items.

I hope this helps answer your question.

Brock
http://www.BrocksPerformance.com

How do the hot roders tunes their high horse fuel injected cars?

The reason I'm not super elated is because I don't have a direct comparison of before and after mods. Plus the fact that brocks own test bike (and others) have been a bit higher, and yes - others lower. I do know dynos can vary. Plus at this point, there are too many unknowns. Was it done in 4th, or 5th? Was it SAE or STD? what was the air pressure in the tire? Was there tire slip, was that due to it being a new Pirelli angel gt? Is the new Pirelli heavier?

In my mind... it makes what it should make, on average. Would I have been happier with numbers on the high end of the scale (ie 215+) ? yes. would I have been disappointed if it was under 200, yes.

The reason I don't have a direct comparison between before and after, on the same dyno at least; is they left the tcs ON when a quick baseline pull was made last fall. They were in a hurry to get the bike put away in storage while the parts came in, so oh well. This resulted in a 165 rwhp #. Obviously not right. On another dyno in Ohio last summer, it made just shy of 185 on a hot day (almost 90), tcs off.

To be honest, I really was hoping for results more Brocks Louisville slugger; or his other results from a bike with ct duals. Cant find the exact numbers right now, but I know they made over 215? 125tq? The results I can find are with mr12, which cant compare. I may run some of that when I go back to the place I originally dyno'ed at, and see if I can get close to those results. We'll see.

EDIT - For comparison, I found the AH2 numbers I was thinking of. Brocks AH2, 5th gear, Guhl ecu, Alison <0 oil, petron additive, PcV with 0 map, 30 psi in tire, made: 211.74 / 125.29.

The setup I have are Brocks CT Duals, BMC Air filter, Alison 0-20w oil, Petron additive, PcV - brocks street map (with fine tuning by the shop), Guhl flash, Unknown tire pressure, unknown what gear the pull was made in.

Not a totally direct comparison, I know. If I went to Brocks shop, would it pull +5hp / +4tq?

maybe I'm thinking about this too much. But darn it, its been a long winter; and I want to ride this thing. lol.

* Last updated by: rod442 on 3/27/2014 @ 12:48 AM *

Don't be disappointed.
The only way you could compare say the slugger is to roll your bike onto the same dyno minutes after its had a run.
the air/ time of day / month/ year. dyno/ operator. all play parts in making power.
Performance is hard to measure. Dyno's are a tool.
It can be done.
I like to test my mods at the track.
And refer to the dyno when needed.

Exactly. A dyno is merely a tool used for tuning. People get caught up in the numbers, but the only numbers that matter on a dyno is seeing that number go up from your baseline on the same day.

Real world #'s on a properly calibrated dyno are 190-193ish with a full system, pcv and a flash on SAE smoothing 5
That's it.

My Dyno was 200.2/120.2 with Akra headers, yosh r-77's, PCv, and Brock's flashed ECU.

I like having the dyno just so I can show it... however I know it (like Maverick) when my eyeballs are getting mashed into my skull and my friends are rapidly disappearing in the mirrors!

I went from 202 on one dyno .... 63% humidity day....
to a very accurate Dyno in the GTA and posted 190....
After tuning I got 193... That was a realistic #, but I wasn't at all put off by it.

I will be on a dyno soon and I'm looking for about 191 or so. I will put my low 190 dyno sheet bike against the 215 horse dyno sheet bikes ANY day of the year. We can even do roll on tests to eliminate rider ability from the equation because lets face it.... Roll on racing is ZERO skill mode. ZERO.......

Well mine was 202 ... I guess I'm unhappy because it only runs 8.42 ..Sarcasm :) Brock slugger bike had 0 wt oil , o rings cut off the chain and MR12 fuel .. You just can't compare your bike to his bike ..If you read a bit deeper into brocks testing you will find he had to run 31 PSI in the tire or it would spin on the dyno and drop HP ..The CTs do make a few more pony's over the alien head( proven ).. I would be very happy with your numbers ..

The test that most dyno guys do not do is this ..Run the bike in time based mode .. You tune the bike to the fastest time from 3500 to red line , the faster time number will be the best map .. That map might show less HP on the dyno at 11200 but will be faster on the street and track ..Dyno numbers at 11200 RPMs are just good for talking around the camp fire , what's under those numbers counts more ..Again my bike at 202 hp and runs 8.42 @ 163.95 Hummm makes you think doesn't it ...:)

* Last updated by: Smokinzx14 on 3/27/2014 @ 5:59 PM *

Don Shows His #'s with Brocks Exhaust, Guhl Guts Flashed ECU. Bike Made 190.55hp with Pump Fuel & 194.73hp E-85

Thanks for the responses guys. I may have come off more bummed than a really am. I guess a good way to put it, is I'm content? but no ecstatic Or hmmm. IDK. Maybe it all stems back to the Stock dyno run. I didn't feel super about the number that day, IE under 185. I really wanted 190+

I had read about a bunch of pulls that were 190 or more, and was really hoping mine would be in the top % of bikes. I got hung up on the initial (early) numbers RG pulled on the bike he had, or Brock. Which was what? 195+

I have a bunch of magazine tests that all show higher pulls than my 184.xx, and only one was lower. That was 183 or something. So to be in the middle or tword the lower end of guys that have full bolt on's, I wanted more. lol.

Again, I realize it is what it is. and I need to find out more variables. IE fuel octane, gear, correction factor, tire psi, STD, SAE, etc. Like, if they ran 92/93 octane; I know most people that run Brocks stuff run better numbers at the track on 89. Brock himself said 89 makes better power. maybe that's just part of it.

Anyway, thanks again. Lee - smokin, Romans, Mav, zx14, etc I value your guys opinions, and try and read as much stuff as I can about your results, trials, tests, whatever.... You guys are some of the groundbreakers in this platform.

I don't know if Ill ever get a chance to really tell if this bike of mine is as strong as the dyno thinks it is. Ive raced a lot of cars, but never made a pass on a bike. I would like to change that this year, but for now I am unwilling to change the suspension to make it easier to launch. Its a streetbike first, and will remain at SWB, and stock height. At least until I catch the bug, and start chasing numbers. lol. There is a guy at my local track that has a white '13 that's modded. he is pretty quick at SWB, if I feel I can trust him to make a pass; maybe we'll see whats what.

I plan to stop by the shop today and pick up the graph. Ill post it here so you guys can check it out.

Hope that works.

Bike should go into the high 9s at stock height and without straps fairly easily. Let us know how that goes.

Your humidity and correction factors from first pull to the last are completely different. Rendering those results pretty much inaccurate. The pulls were done how many months apart??? Just pointing that out. Stock it made 165hp???? Wtf?

* Last updated by: Cblast on 3/29/2014 @ 8:17 AM *

cblast, I already pointed out (in my 2nd post) that they forgot and left the tcs on when the first pull was made. Hence why it only pulled to 8K. IGNORE THAT. lol. I had to show them how to turn it off before they tuned it.

Stock was 184.xx at the dealer I got it from in Ohio; on a hot day, last summer.

* Last updated by: rod442 on 3/30/2014 @ 3:04 AM *

Rod442 I think you are in fine shape with the numbers you posted , It's going to be a hand full to ride fast at the track ( ask anyone that has tried it ).. Even in stock form the bike is hard to ride fast at the track .. Once you get some seat time in and get some base lines to work with you can then revisit the tune if needed ..Good luck and have fun at the track ...