I know not many of you guys here are into these kind of mods so I thought I would share few pics. ZX14 likes her mods.

With my set up every degree of timing I pulled for safety cost me roughly 3 to 6hp. Timing Was Flashed back into ECU Today. Can't wait to try it. Pumped !

Pic shows injector being timed to measure 441 cc of Meth

Pump to simulate Boost Plus Time To Flow of Meth

Clean And Neat No hoses

Meth Tank,, Can't see it,, correct ? bike Must Remain A Sleeper

* Last updated by: Romans on 3/19/2015 @ 10:39 AM *

Sweet! Go for a spin tomorrow... 13C!!

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Really cool! Windshield washer fluid!! ?? I want.

Does this work with nitrous? How much does the system cost?

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Water/methanol injection is not a new thing. The injection method was used extensively on many WW II aircraft to increase HP as much as 95%, the P51 was a prime example. About 5 min or so was about the max they could run due to limited amount, about 20 gal, of water/methanol they carried. My step-dad flew 51's and I heard him talk about it many times. Mechanics hated it because it overstressed the engines and required shorter between overhaul times. US, Brits, and Germans all used similar methods along with nitrous, hard to believe they were doing it back then. Modern metallurgy advances make the use much safer on the engines now as opposed to back then.

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US, Brits, and Germans all used similar methods along with nitrous,

I'm getting one..someday.

How much?

....this is really cool!

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/15/2015 @ 9:49 PM *

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I'm getting one..someday. How much?

Click Here

You could do a controlled system for around 400 bucks. Very cheap insurance for the safety it provides. This is the kit currently installed on the bike. Kit shown comes with a tank which you don't need.

As Rktsled pointed out, issue with Methanol is It Runs out. Like C02 or NOS just another thing to keep a eye on. UGH !

Hopefully A one litre tank will last me 3 or 4 days. Time will tell. This is all new to me. As was mixing my own Boost Juice 60% Meth to 40% Water. Windshield water would have been much easier just not as high quality.

Tuning With Meth will be a head scratcher. Currently with fuel pressure rising from 43 to 90psi and now Methanol pump psi Rising from 0 to 150 joined to a Turbo Flashed ECU make will be make tuning lots of fun. Reward will be worth it. Once sorted Boost Going Up. With Steam engine affect Torque will be insane. Currently at the point now where back tire will not hold on street pavement so brakes going on after this.

I did not wire in a low fluid switch as I did not have one.(dumb) Although I did wire in a controller trouble warning LED Light over the speedo(shown In Pic below). Plan is to run this for a few Months then switch over to a intercooler. ZXBeast Bike has taken the place of mine as the bike being used for the Intercooler prototype.(sorry Buddy Lol Luv it) His Bikes has been in the shop for quite some time now. Looking for the perfect cores is taking some time.

Anyway playing motorcycle can be lots of Fun. Cheers

Rick, here's a good source for intercoolers of all sizes, shapes, and types:

http://www.bellintercoolers.com/

Corky Bell also designs and manufactures fuel pressure regulators (BEGI), among other things.

http://www.bellengineering.net/index.php?cPath=7_76

Corky has been doing this stuff a long time and is great to deal with.
Hope these links help.
Hank

* Last updated by: HanksZX on 3/16/2015 @ 7:03 AM *

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Rick, here's a good source for intercoolers of all sizes, shapes, and types:

Thank You for the links Hank. I was looking at Stedman kits but when I started asking question all went quiet and could not get a answer. 330 to 340hp on pump with stock motor WTF. Scary

Click Here

I'd shy away from that source....
Enough said.

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I can see my computer skills could use a tune up too...lol

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I'd shy away from that source....Enough said.

hmmm, 3rd time I Have heard this.

Listing Format: Fixed Price
Price per item: Buy Now for $795.00
Shipping Cost: View Option(s)
Quantity: 5
Closes: 21 Days, 4 Hours
Location: Alabama
Started : 3/7/2015 4:14:53 PM
Ends: 4/6/2015 4:14:53 PM
Seller: Sales (0)

Sales "Zero"spesks volumnes. This alone was enough to turn me off.

Kit shown comes with a tank which you don't need.

What do you keep the meth in on the bike if you don't use the tank provided in the kit?

With Steam engine affect Torque will be insane.

I was thinking the same thing today. You're going to be getting some boost even at low rpm with the steam expansion.

Plan is to run this for a few Months then switch over to a intercooler.

If you sell, let me know...pay ya full price of brand new if I have the $$$ (remind me that i said that ).

Anyway playing motorcycle can be lots of Fun.

Well ya, and about all you can do if you can't ride because of weather or work hours.

If you can compare the performance enhancement of a 500 bhp stock car engine to a 190 bhp bike engine, looks like we can expect about 17% increase in hp?? +32 engine hp = ~ +25 rwhp??? ...ya think? $400 is a bargain for 25 hp but tell me, why not just increase the turbo psi to make 25 hp more (or in my case, bigger nitrous nozzles)? I guess the cooling effect might be one big advantage of the water/meth system. If all you do is up the turbo boost, you get more hp but you also get more heat.

Also, there is a point where the rods are going to let go regardless of how the boost is being achieved. I can get 80 shot nozzles but dare not boost any higher than that without engine building. ...but this is so awesome, who cares if i really NEED it?

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/16/2015 @ 4:45 PM *

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Nice. I used Meth on my EVO 8 back in the day. Except I was using denatured alcohol.

...this just gets cooler by the minute. WANT! Do I need? does it matter? I want!

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I'm in love! Those cheap China gage stickers you boyz rock kill my mojo. Beyond that, very nice. A hunting you will go, a hunting u will go! Hi ho dinario. Beastie get the boost gage yet? Lol

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I think you are misunderstanding how the power is gained by using the meth injection. In the case of our turbo bikes it is cooling the intake charge and it allows us to use more boost which in turn equates to more power. But, in Roman's case I believe he is just adding back in the timing which he pulled out of the motor for safety as the meth kit is adding the safety back already. From what I've learned from Romans, with your planned NOS setup you wouldn't need the meth injection. The NOS hit is already giving you a cooling effect = running cooler with NOS, than with a turbo setup. How soon before you start the NOS install Rook? I'm sure alot of folks on here are looking forward to your tutorial and photos of the install. I'm sure you will influence alot of peeps already on the fence about it and who are not sure of the steps for the install.

* Last updated by: zx14beast on 3/17/2015 @ 7:50 AM *

From what I've learned from Romans, with your planned NOS setup you wouldn't need the meth injection. The NOS hit is already giving you a cooling effect = running cooler with NOS, than with a turbo setup.

I might get one anyway just because it is so cool. Maybe throw that on the busa for the turbo I hope to install one day. Maybe I'd try it on the 14 and switch back and forth between it and NOS to see the dif. ...if the lowend gain is better with meth and you could have it automatically shut off when the nitrous window opens, you would have high and low chemical induction same idea as a twin turbo (you can see I'm trying to talk myself into this).

How soon before you start the NOS install Rook? I'm sure alot of folks on here are looking forward to your tutorial and photos of the install.

Should be on by June. I'm fiddling with brackets for all the stuff back there. Almost done with my Ohlins control relocator brackets so I'll have room for the nitrous bottles. Also have to make a bracket for the rectifier since I took the tail subframe off. Tutorials already started on all of this stuff.

Dreaming of selling these different brackets I'm designing but I don't know how much demand there will be. Pics coming soon.

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/17/2015 @ 10:39 AM *

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Well, Wolfie will be very, very interested to see how all this works out I'm sure. I bet he'd take a set of your plates.....

It's a little bling but most are hidden away neatly under the fairings. Nice way to go with a DynoTune system if you want to remove the tail rails and the rear footpeg brackets. I'll have to hit him up when I get all this stuff finished. IDK if it will be cost effective. No machine shop tools. All careful hacksaw, file and dremel work. Looks good though.

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What do you keep the meth in on the bike if you don't use the tank provided in the kit?

Rook if you look closely at pic 3 you will see custom Meth Tank Built into the frame of the swing arm. Cap on the top will tell some people that's not usual but I'm hoping most miss it. Glad you didn't see it.

I guess the cooling effect might be one big advantage of the water/meth system. If all you do is up the turbo boost, you get more hp but you also get more heat.

Exactly, let me explain a little about the reasoning for my addition of Methanol.

I’m going to use 91 octane pump gas as my fuel since that seems to be the highest and most available. When adding a turbo or increasing the boost, we are greatly increasing the compression of the motor.

So how much boost can be added before the motor goes Boom? This is where we talk about the knock threshold. If you add boost, you need to add fuel. That part is simple, more air + more fuel = more hp.

Issue is we can’t we just install huge fuel injectors and run 30 psi because every fuel has a point where it Auto Ignites and 91 octane reaches that limit far before we ever see that 30psi.

To raise the “Anti-Knock Index” is the game at hand here. If we increase our effective octane ratio we can add more boost. The biggest reason "Any" alcohol injection is effective, is the increased octane it has over 91 pump gas. Methanol (Meth) has a (MON) rating of 105. So when Meth is sprayed into the intake it effectively raises the octane of fuel that is injected into the combustion chamber. More octane = more boost, Sweeeeet.

Water in itself IS NOT a means to increase your octane but when injected into the motor, it evaporates upon entry into the combustion chamber absorbing lots of heat as it does so. This allows our 91 octane fuel to remain stable even at higher boost levels.

That's the coles notes of my End Game here. I've wanted to try this from day one when I got into Boost back in 2007. Short summers equals to little time.

With the kit now currently installed, learning to tune with Methanol begins. Should not take me long, then 2 lbs more Boost going in. From here we see if Motor stays together. With the ZX14 Each pound of Boost equals 15 to 16 hp. This will truly test the limits with zero room for error. I have Never Blown up a Turbo Bike. 2015 may be my year. Hoping With my Turbo Flash Joined with Methanol/water my risk is greatly reduced.

Still in shock stedman can get 340hp out of a All stock motor. I'd call BS but one never knows for sure. Maybe once lol

* Last updated by: Romans on 3/18/2015 @ 4:39 PM *

Dreaming of selling these different brackets I'm designing but I don't know how much demand there will be. Pics coming soon.

Fish On. Do tell. I'm looking for bottle brackets. Meth tank rendered my bottle bracket useless. Show me what you've got.

Let's make methanol and drink all the ethanol

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Rook if you look closely at pic 3 you will see custom Meth Tank Built into the frame of the swing arm.

Sneaky. Cops will never notice that.

Fish On. Do tell. I'm looking for bottle brackets. Meth tank rendered my bottle bracket useless. Show me what you've got.

I don't think you'd want these bottle brackets. They put the bottles in clear view under the tail fairings. It's a Dynotune twin bottle system but it is mounted to the tail frame. Tis leaves you free to go without the footpeg brackets if you have a shorty exhaust or an aftermarket muffler hanger or if you do not have any muffler on the right and don't want the footpeg bracket there just to serve as a place to mount the dynotune bottle bracket. My brackets are really adapters. You use the Dynotune bracket but mount it to my adapter which bolts to the frame where the rectifier is on the right and there is a couple bolt holes on the left that can be used. The DynoTune bracket comes out of the groove in the tail fairing where the tail subframe was (you need to remove the subframe). It's a perfect fit. This is all hinges on the possibility of reversing the heads on the DynoTune brackets. I see little allen screws so looks like that is totally possible. here's the PhotoShop I did last winter. Notice the bottles under the tail and where the brackets come out. If you are familiar with DynoTune brackets, you can see these brackets have the head reversed to hold the bottle from the opposite side DynoTune intended....but that's what I need to reach inside the tail fairing...to my adapter.

You might consider carving out the passenger seat. Plenty of room under there for a big bottle. ...or a meth tank, for that matter. I'm still into posing. I like showing all my stuff but if I get some unwanted attention from the po, I guess it goes to stealth mode. I'd have my meth tank right on top of the swingarm.

I am just finishing up the Ohlins shock control bracket for the oil reservoir. They one I envisioned in my Photoshop above would be too cramped with the NOS bottles.

Here's how the revised design holds the res. This is a PhotoShop again. The bracket has not been installed yet.

Here's a cardboard mockup so you see what it looks like.

Test fitting base.

Test fitting brace and base together. Unfortunately, I have no other way to do this but JB Weld the two parts together. I couldn't see carving this in one piece out of a solid block of aluminum by hand.

There's a similar one planned for the LH side to hold the preload control.

Added benefit, you can actually reach the controls from a riding position without having arms like a spider monkey.

Let's make methanol and drink all the ethanol

I know I need one.

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/18/2015 @ 3:59 PM *

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Rook, you need to listen to Romans and beast on this, they have it exactly right. By cooling the incoming charge you can run higher chamber pressures without detonation. By itself you would see little if any gain in HP, maybe even lose a little do to delayed propagation of the flame front because of the water. Again, Romans and beast are right on with their explanations!!!

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^^Beastie my plates?
Huh?

I think he was talking about the adapters I'm making (plan to make) for my DynoTune nitrous bottles. See my last post on this thread, first paragraph with pics.

Rook, you need to listen to Romans and beast on this, they have it exactly right. By cooling the incoming charge you can run higher chamber pressures without detonation. By itself you would see little if any gain in HP, maybe even lose a little do to delayed propagation of the flame front because of the water. Again, Romans and beast are right on with their explanations!!!

Crap. Maybe someday if there is a turbo in my future.

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