Has anyone ever put all the tune/flash or whatever else subjectively back to back on a dyno? Same bike, same day, same dyno? I am a subjective consumer. Vic is sharing his experience with a tune. Thank you for opening this forum. Thank you Romans for your open candor and experience. As a consumer I appreciate it. Drag racers know to the nanosecond if something works or doesn't work. 99% of the rest of us are asswholedynos. Go ahead and spell check me on this. If my tune makes my bike smoother, more responsive gves me more confidence in my riding areana, has it done its job? Yes or know what? Haven't seen compared to anything other than Vic stock ecu. I understand Vic, I don't feel any difference. That would be disappointing! I feel a difference with my tune/flash, I haven't put my bike on a dyno, I'm happy with the perceived difference. If anyone wants to put an end to the mumbojumbo and send a tune/flash, I would gladly use my bike Gen1 to clear the air on a dyno, flash to flash. Here let me know where I am at. Can I hang with the 14Rs cause I am tired of talking about tapping my helmet for the popo on the 14page for 2 weeks.

Lets piss off HUB you need medication dude cause only special people can understand you.

Woohoo I road Hurricane Ridge Friday and I don't care. Give me another drink cause it is Sunday and work sucks. Happy Monday everyone.

BlahBlahBlah. People want to know but the bull shit just gets to deep for most.

Personal opinion.

Rook I don't mean to be offensive with what I'm going to say. But you're either not reading what I'm posting, or not paying attention to it, maybe you're just skimming? You can't be serious about trying to use some digital timer and comparing your times to what I listed... that's nutbar factor 6.

Actually, no. I've spent quite a bit of time reading this thread but as I'm sure you are aware, the discussion has become quite lengthy.

I was totally serious. Before you flashed, did you not hope there would be enough difference to easily detect with a hand held stop watch? I sure would. Heck, I was hoping we would see a clear difference by using the youtube timer at the bottom of the screen. Since we do not, I concur with your assertion that video frames and time are a highly accurate method of detecting and timing the beginning and end of each run and that is necessary because the stock times and the flashed times are virtually the same as far as most of us would be concerned. We both come to the same conclusion, you with your video software and me with my daughter's swim watch. I salute you for your flash testing savvy and I never doubted for a moment that you had meticulously collected your data. If I did, I guess I would have loaded your video onto my own video software. Not necessary, the stopwatch tells the tale for me. Your bike is the same with or without the flash you have. It's like you have an ECU that was flashed to stock...or not flashed.

Someone else send their flashed ECU to Vic.

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Someone else send their flashed ECU to Vic.

Good one, Rook. Eyes gots me one of them there wooly setups, can upload the map that is in there now, look around and see if it's a $75 all she wrote, say nothing on line, but report back to Vic... Oh guess who's out of the loop now?

And yes, let's piss off dave and use my wholefatassitter as the dyno. We both have the same year bikes, same fat ass so it's a matter of pulling over, it's done at 200 feet, 200 yards. Either way, she is going to buzz some sort of tone or not.

* Last updated by: Hub on 7/6/2015 @ 12:51 AM *

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I was totally serious. Before you flashed, did you not hope there would be enough difference to easily detect with a hand held stop watch? I sure would.

I've already answered this before in the thread what I expected. Reread the through the thread. Then if you have questions ask me.

Vic - Don't know if you mentioned it, but will you be requesting a refund for the flash? (or maybe a partial refund if it;s accomplishing some of the claimed goals for you)

This isn't a bitching or trashing thread.

As far as a refund, no, I have not requested any refund at this point. Even at that, the money can be refunded but the ECU can never be restored to bone stock (due to the WRT password issue). I would think CBlast would eventually read this thread. If he wants to offer a refund, that might be the approach I take.

I am considering selling the ECU though, although I'm sure that would be at a significant loss considering I have $700+ in it.

Do I recommend the CBlast flash? NO.

the money can be refunded but the ECU can never be restored to bone stock (due to the WRT password issue).

Wait a minute. Woolich has a password to lock your own ECU so even the flasher that locked it can't unlock it, you prefer it back to stock? No no way! Way? I don't see that option unless I am short an update to have that option in the software, because I don't see it?

* Last updated by: Hub on 7/7/2015 @ 7:03 PM *

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'I was totally serious. Before you flashed, did you not hope there would be enough difference to easily detect with a hand held stop watch? I sure would.'

I've already answered this before in the thread what I expected. Reread the through the thread. Then if you have questions ask me.

That was a rhetorical question. If you reread the thread you will find my answer. Sorry for adding useless comments to your thread which has already gone 4 pages. Thanks for posting the info.

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Wait a minute. Woolich has a password to lock your own ECU so even the flasher that locked it can't unlock it, you prefer it back to stock? No no way! Way? I don't see that option unless I am short an update to have that option in the software, because I don't see it?

I was curious and asked Woolich. See replies below.

q: If I were to flash my ECU with the base map would my ECU be 100% stock without any remnants of the flash?
a: Yes from the perspective of the maps and settings it will be back to stock.
q: The " perspective" reference implies the image will be different? Of so how? Thanks.
a: We add a small amount of data for things like bin file notes and unification settings etc, but these are stored in blank area of the bin file.

That was a rhetorical question. If you reread the thread you will find my answer. Sorry for adding useless comments to your thread which has already gone 4 pages. Thanks for posting the info.

Rook: if Vic re-rereads this thread and has any questions regarding your rhetorical question can he pose them here?

(tee hee)

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Each flashing setup assigns it's own unique password. In order for the software to flash a particular ecu, the software must know the correct password otherwise you are locked out.

There is an unlock tool for people that have purchased rights to flash unlimited ecus.
But this tool will only allow the software to unlock and flash.... it never will allow a "virgin" (non-encrypted) file to be installed.

This is how the software can control who can flash and who can't based on the package that you purchase from them.

Once you flash with this software, the BIN file will always be tied to the software.

Ivan

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After all these recent flash threads, I say HOLY CRAP.

Think I'll stay flash-free and avoid problems.

Good luck to those who proceed, tho

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After all these recent flash threads, I say HOLY CRAP.

Think I'll stay flash-free and avoid problems.

Guys,

This is the wrong attitude.... These problems are only happening with one type of software.

Don and I both have had no issues at all with any ecu.

Ivan

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I did not have any issues with Woolich.

Ivan - I'm also referring to the lack-of-performance-increase Vic is experiencing.

I've been waiting, but so far I haven't seen anything concrete showing performance gains ... Instead just quite a few guys responding with various versions anywhere from "feeling decent gains" to "Wow!" but no evidence provided like Vic did.

Is there evidence available?

* Last updated by: extrapolator on 7/8/2015 @ 2:33 PM *

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I can add a dyno chart to my website (when I have the time to get to it) showing just the gains from my flash alone.

The way things are going right now (really busy) probably in the fall I'll have the time to spend with my 14 and retest it again.... before and after minutes apart.

I can't speak for other tuners.... they will show you what they want to.

Ivan

* Last updated by: Ivan on 7/8/2015 @ 2:32 PM *

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Rook: if Vic re-rereads this thread and has any questions regarding your rhetorical question can he pose them here?

I think that would be getting a little too close to a normal conversation. He could post a rhetorical question about my answer to my rhetorical question and answer it himself.

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The thread has gone from
1 claims (unsubstantiated)
2 inventive mud slinging (unsubstantiated)
3 perspective navel gazing (substantiated)
4 credibility attacks (50/50)
5 recommendations
6 and now regret loss (SIU) suck it up
Oh I forgot 6(a) rhetorical and hypothetical questions

Vic you've inspired us.
Thank you

* Last updated by: Wolfman on 7/10/2015 @ 6:59 AM *

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And still no back-to-back dyno runs to verify data derived from a test with to many variables to count....

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Or just to replace because of the bite marks.

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Wolf - It wouldn't be the first time I've fallen for something, and prob not the last either darnit, but what in this thread is unsubstantiated?

* Last updated by: extrapolator on 7/10/2015 @ 1:12 PM *

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Hi extrap
You're right about ^^

I've bought stuff and replaced it. And replaced it again. Some products are outstanding some crap.

Vic claims his flash did not improve the handling of his bike, or the acceleration rather. I call foul on that point alone. My bike made 188 stock with slips, 206 with headers and pcv dyno tune. After adding a 10 over arm longer chain and stock wheels. My bike made 199. 199 on a 10 over arm. I'm happy with that. I love the performance the robust mid range and more importantly mine sounds awesome.

I had the opposite experience/ reaction with my Cflash.

Now having said this...

Here come the attacks on my credibility and friendship relations with c.

* Last updated by: Wolfman on 7/10/2015 @ 3:17 PM *

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For some reason I can't post on this site from my home computer otherwise I'd post the picture. Schnitz has a before and after picture of the 14r flash. I have questioned them about it as it shows an 8hp gain and they don't add timing or fueling.

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Mr Wolf, you are very happy with your flash. And so are many others.
That's great.
Its understandable for you to want to let people know about your positive experience.

But there are also others who are not happy with their flash.
They have a right to talk as well.
Vic simply advised his experience and it wasn't like yours.
I don't see why you should call foul there?

If Vic was the only one, maybe.
But he is not, and is part of a growing group coming forward with flash issues and dissatisfaction.
Are you calling foul on all of them as well?

If you have had a great flash experience I'm happy for you.
But please accept there are others who haven't been as fortunate as you and are simply voicing their opinions on what they have experienced.

* Last updated by: yannih on 7/10/2015 @ 6:18 PM *

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Vic claims his flash did not improve the acceleration rather.

Hey, he had a falling out so toss this one out for any kind of validity. When someone needs new tires or some excuse comes along out of a suitcase with no bottom, or one who can't whack a throttle a few feet, needs new shoes? Watch the excuses come, oh I don't need to prove anything to you ffs-hit.

I call foul on that point alone.

Does it really matter? Here's the toilet look what the shit rolled in? When C admits to Smoke they both came up with 202 not 212? Where was that foul note going; messing up his own test was C? Was that pillow biting; I hope that flies under the radar?

My bike made 188 stock with slips

Okay, here is where I see the mods begin.

206 with headers and pcv dyno tune.

Now it gets confusing... for me that is. I'm saying I went from 188 to 206, but I needed headers and a pig to gain that much. I'd contribute that to the pig. If we removed the pipes altogether, just used the pig as the change in HP, would we? I'll jump in camp yes.

I love the performance the robust mid range and more importantly mine sounds awesome.

Still confused here. Where now we fast forward to a flash [alone] I assume? And here is where I assume you had the bike dyno'd again, found more HP than the pig'206'header hitter, or confused said, you took Vic's flash riding school, took a lesson on thatheory; found less hp with flash alone?

I had the opposite experience/ reaction with my Cflash.

Here, I am in total confusion. We are up to, I had the opposite experience, I lost hp but back to mid range alone is flash alone with more-hp or less-hp made? Where is that flash alone dyno run, if 188/20yada/yada06 and now flash/yada000 batting zero no evidence? You call out Vic and his?

Now having said this... How much are Your flash riding lessons? DATA work for you? One can't wheelie in 200 feet or less using a flash or stock? And now dis? WADA MESS!

Cblast, get in here and straighten thishit out! Meanwhile, I'm heading out to BB&B and test bite a few pillows.

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May I pipe in?Thank you.I got a VERY noticeable increase in performance with C's flash.I also did with Romans,and Ivans.I have to say...I have a Brock's ct single on my 14.That helped.Most definitely.Stock factory mufflers are gonna restrict and work against a flash.Not much,but enough to cause a 'less than' powerful unlocked flash.
I also had Brock's flash and PCV setup on my 2012...it was very good.Moving the power around is important to what a guy wants.Midrange.Low end.Top end.You have to know what ya want out of yer bike.What's 'better' really depends on the guy flashing it.He may be flashing according to HIS feel of the bike.Not yours.That makes a big difference.If you don't convey this to him...he's gonna probably flash it to what he feels you want...which may not be accurate.Does that make sense?It can be a very good flash...yet not meet the wants of the customer still.